Just figuring out that you can instead have one MASTER logic and then have SLAVES without sync.

You would use that PatchBay program to play the other LOGICs as simple sound sources using that method where you put them in infinite play loop.

Then you only need to save ONE song file.

You'd still route audio from the others into the main with the WormHole AU plugin.

I am going to try it now. Guys, it's gonna work! []

Evan Evans

i have to say I am impressed

Nice work Evan -keep pushing that old envelope

Nigel

well, i currently have 2 logics open, each using their own memory space.

logic #1 is using 3.43 GB Virtual Memory and 1.67 GB Real Memory.

logic #2 is using 1.86 GB Virtual Memory and 975 MB Real Space.

so the Virtual Memory of 3.5 GB has clearly been surpassed. of course, the Real Memory for logic has dropped, but that is because i only have 4 GB of RAM and once a program starts swapping files to disk, this happens.

at the moment, i can't play any instruments in the 2nd logic, but i'd imagine this can be worked around with Midipipe/wormhole/etc. but i just don't have time at the moment to dig into making this work.

too bad logic can't be a rewire slave as well as a master - that would streamline everything.

it does look like this could be made to work.

if i get time, i'll tinker more.

cheers

Stuipid8Track and CM,

Indeed. It does work. It loads into seperate RAM space. I had 4 Logics running last night.

S8T,
I used groundbreaking to catch people's attention. But honestly, it is. I mean to be able to use a Dual G5 to it's absolutel capacity instead of what only Logic can do. That's gonna push a Single Apple Dual G5 way past what can be done on a single PC Giga. A war which some enjoy staging. []

And there is PLENTY of reason to load up more Logics. If you don't use any plug-ins in the other Logics, and you pipe your audio and MIDI I/O to the MAIN Logic, then you will have MORE EXS Instances. It doesn't matter that you only have 4GB of RAM. I only have 2GB on my Dual G4 and had 4 Logics running in parallel last night. 256 EXS INstances. 6 Logics will yield, 384 EXS Instances.

According to my technical understanding of OSX, LOGIC, EXS, RAM, Kernel, etc., you should be able to run all your Plug-ins inthe Main Logic and have about 350 EXS Instances running at the same time.

AGOZ,

I think G5s can only hold 8GB. That's with the 2GB Chips.



Evan Evans

P.S. I am very excited about this. As new G5s are coming out in a few weeks, I may sell my current rig and buya depreciated Dual 2Ghz G5 and run 4 to 6 copies of Logic at the same time. This works for me. I love to have everything on tap! THE ENTIRE VSL LIBRARY!!!!

Evan,
on the duals there are 8 slots, so it's 16 GB when you use 2GB modules,
but each module costs 1000$ (ouch!)


Andrea

Dawn Of A New Era! 300+ EXS Instances! Shatter the 4GB RAM Barrier!!!



MARCH 9th, 2004

"The Dawn Of The New Era"

by Evan Evans


It's not easy being a guru. You get calls from people asking you for help with little things all the time. The pay sucks. But every once in a while an innovation comes out of it that makes it all worth while.

It was early this morning (the end of my Monday work day), a friend in Sweden asked me if there was a way to get Klopfgeist to go to Audio Instrument #1. We worked with it for a few minutes trying to do it. No avail.

Instead I suggested he use an external MIDI sound module. Then within 1 minute a cavalcade of brainstorm thoughts started to stream through my brain.

- Why not use a little AU Host app and run a simple click and route it to it with a Virtual MIDI port of a MIDI PATCHBAY
- That would free up another EXS Instance
- I thought, what little other APP could we use?
- I thought I could just run another instance of Logic Platinum
- But that doesn't work
- And surely the XSKey wouldn't let you do that
- But actually you can do that if you just rename the APP
- Whoa. This way we could overcome the 4GB limit that G5 users have been experiencing with Logic, by running a totally separate copy of it in another RAM Space (that's how OSX works) AND have more than 64 Audio Instruments running at the same time under one hood.
- You could then access the other copy with MIDI Patchbay and sync them over some kind of MIDI Sync Piping.
- Oh heck, why not run 3, 4, 5, 6+ versions of Logic
- And you could PIPE back the audio to the MAIN Logic with WormHole AU
- Oh heck, why not just set the other Logics into Loop Play and use them as simple sound modules?

Surely someone had thought of this before. I have been playing a lot of online Poker lately and it's not a good idea to share your tricks or everyone would get as good as you and make all the money ... Maybe someone has figured this out but kept it to themselves! But the possibility of it has only been around since Dual G4s, and certainly with the more recent G5s. So maybe there just hasn't been enough time for anyone to realize it, let alone set it up and do it, which would take a few days. But if they did, maybe they hoarded it for themselves. Well, I for one have never been like that. I think if we level the playing field, we each have our own musical gifts and talents and there is still more respectable ways to forge ahead and make money. So I am sharing this with you ALL. You can thank me here (310) 691-8163 (Gotta love the prank calls that are gonna come from this!)

So I tried it. I duplicated and renamed my Logic Platinum 6.3.3 five times as follows:

Logic Platinum 6.3.3
Logic Platinum 6.3.3 TWO
Logic Platinum 6.3.3 THREE
Logic Platinum 6.3.3 FOUR
Logic Platinum 6.3.3 FIVE
Logic Platinum 6.3.3 SIX

It worked. They all ran flawlessly. Connect them up with MIDI Patchbay, pipe Audio back to busses in the MAIN Logic with WormHole AU, and bingo!

You can have between 200 and 400+ EXS Instances spread across different Logics this way. And since I have about 200 Instruments loaded into 63 EXS Instances via keyswitching (using VSL Pro Edition), I can run over 1,200 instruments. Having them all on tap. It's possible on a Dual G5 to actually have about 350 EXS Instances sound at the same time, but who the heck writes like that? Likely this is to have all the instruments "on tap". Still using only 50 to 150 tracks for writing.

This whole concept is best for orchestral writing where you can set up a template. Because you can't use AutoLoads with this setup or all the different Logics will load the same sounds up. instead you must save a different template file for each Logic. But because you are using the other Logics as a soundsource you have some benefits and one downfall:
[continued below]

Thanks Evan this is amazing. Who could imagine it would work?

I have a problem with the AU Midi spec. I can only send on Port 1 from DP4 to Logic on the same G5. 'cause I use DP4 to write . The IAC bus is useless. DP can send ok but Logic is 'stuck' with its' Physical Input port and yes I have used Channel Splitters galore.

Using Midi Patchbay the EXS will only 'see' Port 1. Does anyone know how to add more Ports that Logic Instruments will actually see?

I said 350 for G5 with 8GB.



Evan Evans

> I duplicated and renamed my Logic Platinum 6.3.3 five times

*Now* we're talking !

> It worked. Connect them up with MIDI Patchbay

To get MIDI over to the other apps, right ? is this a function of the OS or is it a third party app ?

> I can run over 1,200 instruments. Having them all on tap.

Way to go, dude. Now, this nicely coincides with my current plan of building a dedicated PC for GigaStudio3 and all the involved hassles (either buying MIDi interfaces and GSIF-2 audio cards *or* getting FX-teleport and Giga-VST adapter to run, which would rely on a new G5 anyway). What a nice twist.

> It's possible on a Dual G5 to actually have about 350 EXS Instances sound
> at the same time,

So, you create, like, 30 Multi Instruments in the front Logic and assign their outs to 'MIDI Patchbay' ?
Putting all BackGround Logics in Play is to enable playing multiple EXSs at once, right ? How are the EXSs cabled, as you usually can only live-play the one on the active arrangement track ? While i can patch them directly from the Physical In, this requires a bypassed IO plugin on each EXS *and* Logic being in play to avoid latency. As the BGLs are processing live input, the is no latency compensation active, right ? Not that it matters too much with orch stuff, but am i right ?

How do you get that MIDi from Patchbay back to the background apps ?

> This whole concept is best for orchestral writing where you can set up a
> template. Because you can't use AutoLoads with this setup or all the
> different Logics will load the same sounds up. instead you must save
> a different template file for each Logic.

I'm only peeping over from OS9 here, but if you have multiple Logic folders, couldn't you have separate local Autoloads for the running copies of Logic that way ?

> BENEFIT: All the Song Information is in the main one songfile.

And the orch template itself in the background doesn't change anyway, since it's all set up. Sweet.

> BENEFIT: Share same PREF file so key commands are same and environment can be
> same

The Environment is in the Logic Song, not in the prefs.

> DOWNFALL: only works with true CoreAudio compatible Audio Drivers

Because ? The copies launched later would else claim the hardware from the earlier ones, right, even if they don't actually use the hardware, but pipe audio back into the front Logic ?

> As I see it is a very exciting discovery

Same here.

> and I wanted to share it with you all

Kudos to you. I for one owe you a <insert your fav beverage here> if this really pans out.

Christian


[URL=http://uk.geocities.com/christianobermaier/Gearlist.htm]gear list [/URL] studio pics show reel

lol. No I am very very good. A professional really. People say good luck and what not, but it's a chess game for me, not the lottery. I don't lose money. I lose hands. And I don't win hands, I win money. When I play I typically wait about 60 to 80 hands before going to the flop. Then they are mine.

Evan Evans