It seems now that you can get hold of anything even amazingly enough vsl!! i have seen files available on a certain file sharing platform which will remain unnamed.The files are in 3gig segments with performance tools and crack serial codes.This must be a real thorn in in your side guys,Being software developers.
-
Software piracy
-
VSL,
I think this is a good first post to consider deleting!
Sure these things exist, but let's not advertise it on the VSL board huh?
Evan Evans
-
Hi Paw,
Could you please unveil the name of this specific file sharing platform or directly mail me it´s URL to m.veenenbos@vsl.co.at so that we can take care of this!?! [[:|]]
This is a severe violation of all Copyright and Licensing Agreements and we deem it a slap in the face for all our honest customers and our developers as well!
Thank you, Marnix
-
@Paw said:
It seems now that you can get hold of anything even amazingly enough vsl!! i have seen files available on a certain file sharing platform which will remain unnamed.The files are in 3gig segments with performance tools and crack serial codes.This must be a real thorn in in your side guys,Being software developers.
Is there really a point to this post? "Man, I'm sorry you guys are losing money. Tough."
Especially since they can't really do anything about it. The most they can do, I suppose, is to nab anyone who is actually stupid enough to use the software to openly publish and/or record music. Which brings me to an interesting point.
I actually believe (and I know I am probably going to get flamed for this) that in some instances, software piracy is good for software developers. At least, they reap a sort of benefit from it, in a pragmatica sense. That is not to say that stealing, no matter what the effect, (and piracy is theft) is good.
But let me explain. If someone wants to look at a piece of software but can't afford it (this is all too common), he may be tempted to resort to piracy. He is technically capable of downloading this software (let's call it Program A). It may take him several months to become proficient in it. What he cannot do usually (at least with many professional software) is use that software for commercial means without seriously putting himself at legal risk. So what will he do? As soon as he is proficient enough to make money with Program A, he will buy a legal copy.
This is the result: The developer sells a complete version of Program A and obtains a new loyal, proficient, customer. The new customer (former pirate) receives the benefit of learning the software free of charge and can therefore receive immediate financial benefit from his legal copy. If he never becomes proficient in it, he will not buy it, in which case he has avoided spending thousands of dollars on a software that he will never use. It is true that the developer loses that sale, but I think that loss is offset by the sales made to customers who would never have bought the software but did after learning what a joy it is to use it.
Of course, this does not justify piracy, and it does not work this way in many cases. Most notably for games, professional applications where it is impossible to tell what software was used, and professional applications that people install on more machines than the license allows.
I believe the best way to combat this sort of piracy is for the developer to release non-commercially usable versions at a reduced or (as Softimage 3D has done) zero cost. Then it will not be worth it for a consumer to go through the inconvenience and risk of viruses to download illegal copies. That is what I would do if I were a developer. As far as the multiple machine thing, I say a USB dongle is the way to go. I hate activation codes because I don't always get to use the same machine. It would be nice to be able to take my dongle and move over to another computer, all the while staying within the liscence agreement.
Anyway, any comments would be welcome, but please don't flame me.
~Chris
-
Can we just delete or erase this entire post guys!?
This is a ridiculous topic for this forum.
VSL Team?
Evan Evans
-
@Galleddrim said:
[...] As soon as he is proficient enough to make money with Program A, he will buy a legal copy. [...]
~Chris
Nice concept, but simply not true. i think I'm allowed to say that I'm working mainly in completly professional environments, and you wouldn't believe _how_ many people admit openly that they use cracked programs (and even more often pirated sound-libraries).
****
Apart from that, it's not true that sharing products like ours on P2P-networks doesn't implicate copyright infringements, as this behaviour simply contradicts our licence agreement. Paw, may i please ask you again to (privatly) tell us where you read/heard about this. Thanks in advance.
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library -
anyway, it's a file sharing plateform... you can't do anything, you can't say "FBI i want all that guys that are sharing my software to be captured etc..." [...]
What makes you so sure about that?
/Dietz
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library -
first - what to delete and what not is up to the moderators. dot. no more comments on that please.
second - there is nothing like a cracked serialnumber (this is by design) - you would need serious CPU capacity _and_ to know which one out of the 10^x we decided to use, a serialnumber can be stolen of course, but then it's expired
third - the method is fingerprinting not watermarking - stop speculating
christian
and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds. -
CM,
Is English your second language or just as equal in fluency as your first if not English? Becuase, unless you were actually annoyed and upset in your post, then your English is coming across that way. Your last post was defensive, angular, and short. I am just curious if this is the way you are, or if something is getting lost in translation.
Evan Evans
-
Nice concept, but simply not true. i think I'm allowed to say that I'm working mainly in completly professional environments, and you wouldn't believe _how_ many people admit openly that they use cracked programs (and even more often pirated sound-libraries).
Well... I disagree. I would say its definately is true. Sure it's true for many programs like Windows, Office and others where you cant determine they were used to produce the final product. However very few, if any, professional composers would use pirated products for projects they earn money on. Why? Becuase anyone can hear where the sample is from, and could simply look them up to see if they own a copy. I can hear VSL performance instruments, SAM brass etc miles away - very few would be so stupid.
I would dare say that the amount of money VSL looses on piracy is very limited. Thats not saying that there arent pirated versions out there, or that those using them are doing something legally and morally wrong - but from an econmic standpoint the loss is almost non-existant
-
@Christian Marcussen said:
[...] I would dare say that the amount of money VSL looses on piracy is very limited. Thats not saying that there arent pirated versions out there, or that those using them are doing something legally and morally wrong - but from an econmic standpoint the loss is almost non-existant
I would say that for each legit version of VSL-products thera are at least four pirated copies, as a rough estimation. (This doesn't mean that every user gives away his his stuff four times, it's just to give you an relation.) When we now calculate that only 25% percent of the pirates do _real_ work with their stolen copies, you understand that piracy actually _halves_ our potential income, making our products more expensive in return.
... and I think this estimation is very conservative, BTW.
Is this what you would really call "economically non-existant" ...? [8o|]
And while we're at it: As the project leader for our MIR-developement I can assure you that this great innovation won't see the market before the copy-protection is as good as it can get, nowadays - for exactly the reason explained above. So: piracy not only costs _ your_ money, but hinders fast development of new products on the top of it.
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library -
Let me get this right - You think there are 4 pirated versions of VSL for each ligit, and you think 25% of these get used for real work? I VERY much doubt those figures, esepcialy with VSL. If that is the case it means for each legit version of VSL there is a professional composer using a pirated version? Come on! I would be very suprised if that were true.
Ofcourse if you know this, then I guess i'm wrong - but these estimates sound far from conservative, in fact they sound dead wrong to me. So I would still say, unless proven wrong, that the money you guys are loosing due to piracy is fairly small. I know for a fact several people using pirated samples and the minute they earned money they bought the samples.
That said, i undertsand completely why you want better protection for something like MIR since its very hard to prove that some music was done with MIR. With samples however I would say its fairly easy, and therfore a far too dangerous endevor for a professional composer.
-
I think the bigger point is that if every pirated copy, whether used for real work or not, was actually *purchased* it would represent a huge amount of money. Most of us shelled out a lot of cash for the VSL, and without piracy it could be a tiny bit cheaper.
And may I say, it was worth EVERY PENNY!!! [:D]
