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  4. Keyswitching and Logic Pro, Double-stops

  • Keyswitching and Logic Pro, Double-stops

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    I am new to Vienna Instruments Solo Strings and am having diffulculty implementing keyswitching. I do not have an external controller, everything is sequenced-based (Logic Pro 8.0 on G4). I create a software instrument track, load the presets to the solo violin, create another, identical track where I put the notes that would trigger the keyswitching. Is this correct or am I missing or misunderstanding something. I have read the manual carefully several times. Any help would be appreciated. Also, how can one play double-stops correctly (on one software track)?

    I would appreciate any help, or perhpas there is a video tutorial on this? 
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    Hi Flavio. The keyswitches can go in the same track as the music, no need to create a second track. For double stops, you simply need two notes sounding at the same time, perhaps with one slightly delayed.
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    Conquer, thanks for the info. I was not clear what I meant with double stops. Of course I know that they are 2 notes played at the same time (and one of them can be very slightly delayed). What I should have said is when I input 2 notes the second one does not play as long as the first. It tends to be more of a stuccato than a legato. Any remedy? Or is there a setting I missed? Also, on setting the keyswitches on the same track: I guess I would use a piano grand staff since the keyswithces are located in the bass section (lower note triggers). By the way, I have read that some things do not work or do not work well with Logic Pro 8.0. Do you have any insights/feedback on this topic?

    Thanks again,

    Flavio 
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    @Another User said:

    What I should have said is when I input 2 notes the second one does not play as long as the first. It tends to be more of a stuccato than a legato.
    ...maybe you're using, for double-stops, articulations that are monophonic (ie interval performances)...?
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    Hi Flavio, I think Rino is right - monophonic patches such as legatos and portamentos can only play one note at a time. For double-stopping you need a regular patch like sustain or staccato.

    @flavio said:

    I guess I would use a piano grand staff since the keyswitches are located in the bass section (lower note triggers).
    Yes, although it will make your score look messy. If you always input your notes on the score page it might be better to use MIDI control changes (CC) to change patch, as they will not show in the score. However, that would require some minor re-programming work on the factory matrices.

    I use Logic 7 for sequencing and recording but run the VI's on a separate PC with Vienna Ensemble. I hear that Logic 8 still has a few bugs (which is why I haven't bought it yet) but I believe it generally works OK with Vienna Instruments and has some advantages over Logic 7.
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    Thanks rino. I will try sustain. I am new at VSL. I need to watch the videos online as well.

    Flavio 
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    Conquer, I would rather work with MIDI control changes. I am new to VSL. I am not sure what you mean by minor re-programming. I will watch the VSL online videos, maybe they will show more specifics on how to do this. The short manual that came with VSL is not very helpful on HOW to do things. It just shows WHAT things do.

    Flavio 
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    The factory matrices are programmed so that keyswitches control patch changes on the horizontal (H-Span) axis. Some of the more complex matrices also use CC1 (mod wheel) to control the vertical (V-Span) axis. To eliminate keyswitches you would have to open the Control Edit window and re-program the horizontal control so it reads 'Controller'. 'CC0' will then appear, which you can change to whatever number you like (CC2, CC3, etc.) Once you're happy with it you can save your edited matrix by hitting 'File' and choosing 'Save preset'.
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    @flavio said:

    Thanks rino.

    Flavio 

    You're welcome...
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     Conquer, I know what you are describing. However, I guess I am not familiar enough with Logic Pro 8 to see where I can insert the controllers in Logic. Any help from you or anyone would be appreciated. I appreciate all feedback. I was able to use the keyswitching but it seems not to be consistent. For instance, I can use C1 in one measure then use C1# to make a change and it works. But then I go and replay the music and it does not work! I then need to look for another combination of keys to do the keyswitching! I understand the concepts here but the implementation is lacking. Am I overlooking something?
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    Hi Flavio. One way to create control changes is to use a MIDI keyboard - if you push the mod wheel while in record, the keyboard generates a stream of  CC1 numbers. If you don't have a MIDI keyboard you can use the Logic function called 'Insert Instrument MIDI settings as Events'. (It's in the 'MIDI' menu.) First record some notes, then click on the track you recorded. In its 'Instrument' parameters you should see three little boxes called 'Program', 'Volume' and 'Pan'. Tick the 'Pan' box and untick the other two. Now highlight the region and click on 'Insert Instrument MIDI settings as Events'. Logic will insert a CC10 (Pan) command at the head of the track.

    Using the Event List, you can now edit the number of the CC10 command (i.e. make it CC2, or CC23 or whatever), set its value (0 to 127) and position it where you want a patch change to occur (at least one tick before the first note requiring a patch change). Of course you have to edit the matrix first so that it will recognise your new CC commands.

    This is how it works in Logic Pro 7. My apologies if the revised layout and design of Logic 8 renders my instructions nonsensical!

    @flavio said:

    I was able to use the keyswitching but it seems not to be consistent. For instance, I can use C1 in one measure then use C1# to make a change and it works. But then I go and replay the music and it does not work!
    Make sure the C1 and C#1 are on the same track as the part and that they both occur within the passage you're playing back. One good way to test this is set up a playback loop. To make sure keyswitches are working I often hit the VI's 'Patch Assign' button and watch the patch-switching in action. It sometimes goes wrong because one of the keyswitches is in the wrong octave. Opening Logic's 'Piano Roll' editor helps because I can see the keyswitches on screen and click on them to make sure they're working properly. When they don't, it's almost always due to user error.

    Good luck!
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    Conquer, thanks so much for the info! I will try it tonight. I think the process will be very similar in Logic 8.

    Thanks so much again! 
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    You're welcome - hopefully Logic 8 will work the same way. Fingers crossed!