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Mac Pro/XP64.
Last post Wed, Feb 18 2009 by bitmit, 15 replies.
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Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 01:45
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42

XP64 isn't officially supported by Boot Camp, but I can't be the only person doing this. Is anyone successfully running the VE on a Mac Pro in Windows XP64? I finally gave up trying to get functional inside OS X, and it looked like XP was the preferred OS among VE users on the forum, so I bought and installed it. I have two main problems now - one is described here:

http://community.vsl.co.at/forums/t/17408.aspx?PageIndex=1 

but briefly is that I can only load about 13 instruments or so before the application stops receiving midi.

The other is an increasing amount of pops and crackles as the ram fills up. I have 32gigs, and so far at least have only used <11. I ran this by tech support, but their advice is to buy Vista 64. If I know that'll work I don't mind getting it, but before I do (and likely have a whole other [or the same] set of problems) I thought I'd ask the forum. I have done all the searches I can think of, and so far haven't found anything directly relevant, but someone out there must be doing this - it's not a rare combination. MOTU 2408/PCI 424 for audio, btw.

Also, if I do go the Vista route, which version? I don't know the distinctions between Home/Business/Ultimate and Basic vs Premium.

Thanks for any help.

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 03:21
by Chuck Green
Joined on Thu, Dec 21 2006, Ann Arbor, MI (USA), Posts 518

Hi Bitmit,

I'd be interested as well in seeing what configs are out there that really work.  Just not happy with current MacPro config option.  Question -- if you use Boot Camp do you have to reformat your existing Mac Pro hard drives to PC format?

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 03:34
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42

Boot Camp creates a partition to install Windows to - it does that without having to reformat the OS drive. As far as the library drives go, I had the library across a handful of smaller pc's, so i just put those pc-formatted sata drives in the mac. There is an application you can get that enables XP to read mac formatted drives, although I don't know how fast/reliable etc. they'll be. I can't remember the name of it now, but if I do I'll post again. It's somewhere on the forum too. You get an option when installing winxp which format (it re-formats the boot-camp formatted partition, don't ask me why) to make the partition - fat32 or ntfs, and I think one is more secure where the other is readable in Mac OS, if you need that. Again, can't remember which way, and if there's a performance diff., but that's easy info to find.

I had the same thought - do I have to re-install the entire library? I think there are ways of avoiding it. It'd almost be a deal breaker for me.

HTH.

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 10:19
by Sergino Futurino
Joined on Thu, Dec 18 2003, Italy, Posts 652

 I have far better results with Vista 64 on my Mac Pro than I had with XP 64!

Sergino

www.sergiobrunetti.it
Windows 10 on Vertex4 SSD - AMD Ryzen 9 5950X - 32 GB RAM -
2010 MacbookPro 2.66 Ghz 8 Giga RAM -
MOTU: 2408 MK3, 24i, Traveler,MIDI Express XT
Studio One 4.1 Pro, Notion 6.5, Sibelius 6.2, Kontakt 5.6
VE Pro 6, VI Pro 2, Vienna Suite, Vienna MIR Pro w/Roompacks 1 and 2,
Libraries (preload size 2408): Special Edition Standard and Plus, Appassionata I, Solo Strings I, Dimension Brass, Percussion, Soprano Choir, Upright Bass, Flugelhorn, Saxophones, Concert guitar, Jazz Drums, Epic Orchestra, Dimension Strings
Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 13:33
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42

Better how? Can you elaborate? What was happening before that isn't now (or vice versa)?

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 14:20
by Sergino Futurino
Joined on Thu, Dec 18 2003, Italy, Posts 652

 XP 64 is not officially supported from Bootcamp.

Me , and if I remember well somedody in VSL, have had problems to set up all the the Bootcamp XP 64 drivers.

with Vista 64 the drivers went in the right way without doing anything special.

Me and a friend of mine have tested two dfferent PC and finded that Vista 64 is better of XP 64 in the same ways as Viista 32 is worse than XP32.

The same applòications seem more "fluid".

I must add that the two PC have 8 and 16 giga of RAM each.

Vista requires plenty (a lot) of RAM, (I have 0 virtual memory) but with that it is a more up to date Operating System

www.sergiobrunetti.it
Windows 10 on Vertex4 SSD - AMD Ryzen 9 5950X - 32 GB RAM -
2010 MacbookPro 2.66 Ghz 8 Giga RAM -
MOTU: 2408 MK3, 24i, Traveler,MIDI Express XT
Studio One 4.1 Pro, Notion 6.5, Sibelius 6.2, Kontakt 5.6
VE Pro 6, VI Pro 2, Vienna Suite, Vienna MIR Pro w/Roompacks 1 and 2,
Libraries (preload size 2408): Special Edition Standard and Plus, Appassionata I, Solo Strings I, Dimension Brass, Percussion, Soprano Choir, Upright Bass, Flugelhorn, Saxophones, Concert guitar, Jazz Drums, Epic Orchestra, Dimension Strings
Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 15:30
by Chuck Green
Joined on Thu, Dec 21 2006, Ann Arbor, MI (USA), Posts 518

Thanks bitmap.  I thought of switching last year but that would mean for me reloading the entire VSL library across three 760s plus all the other libraries and I wasn't quite up to doing that.  I think I was also hoping the Apple would come out with their 64 bit OS and VSL with there 64 bit support and everything would be fine - I hope.  At this point not sure if I want to wait until fall or early winter. 

Not sure from a performance perspective that I would want to have a translator utility in the middle of my read operations, especially using a DAW environment.  I would probably bite the bullet and reload everything.....  

Please let me know what config you end up with and how it performs.  Thanks for your response to my question..... 

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 15:33
by Chuck Green
Joined on Thu, Dec 21 2006, Ann Arbor, MI (USA), Posts 518

Also, I understand from individuals at Sweetwater, that one can just take the Mac Pro and load Vista without even having the Mac OS X operating system on the machine.  Use it as an Intel PC.

Has anyone tried that approach and if so, did it work out for you?

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 15:49
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42

I wondered about that - just make it a pc, right?. From VSL tech support - "Apple doesn´t tell which components are installed on its motherboards - so it´s very hard to find the right drivers." Vista drivers come with, where XP64 drivers are a go-get-em-yourself deal. I don't know if my problems are driver related, but against my better judgment I've ordered Vista. We'll see how it goes.

I was just trying a workaround with VE3, and the midi issue seemed to disappear. Still a lot of pops & crackles though, and after 8 instances I couldn't create another - the host plugin window just stayed disconnected. Is there a limitation in the demo?

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 16:40
by Chuck Green
Joined on Thu, Dec 21 2006, Ann Arbor, MI (USA), Posts 518

Not sure if there is a limitation on the VE3 demo.  VE2 has no limitations....

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 17:33
by cm
Joined on Fri, Dec 20 2002, vienna, Posts 9121

 chuck, theory says VISTA can be installed on a macPro actually without having OS X on the machine (VISTA SP1 supports EFI), but i didn't try it so far.

devices from the motherboard can be identified using the device manager (properties of unidentified device) and the Vendor and Device ID shown ... (google is your friend then)

Hardware IDs

 

VE3 demo has no limitation except the  - i'm almost tempted to say usual - 30 days 30 starts date license limitation

christian

and remember: a CRAY is the only computer that runs an endless loop in just four hours ...
Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 18:45
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42

Let me see if I understand this correctly. Paul at VSL tech support says "Apple doesn´t tell which components are installed on its motherboards - so it´s very hard to find the right drivers." - a direct quote. Based on this I buy Vista 64. Then Christian at VSL tech support says actually it's quite simple - you just look in the device manager, and google the Vendor and Device ID. So it looks like I could have isolated whether or not I had driver issues before I dropped $200 on Vista. Here's how I feel about that. Like most of the people on this forum I've spent a lot of money on Vienna Products over the years. I don't mind that - it's a quality product. I'm also not averse to spending money to solve a problem, but I get a bit ticked off when I waste it because I could have had better, or let's say more complete, advice.

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 18:58
by cm
Joined on Fri, Dec 20 2002, vienna, Posts 9121

 bitmit, you are leaving me a little bit clueless what you like to tell us ...

paul is correct: apple does not tell and it is very hard to find ...

i've added how you can find it if you really need to - i didn't say it will be easy to identify the components and moreover find the drivers then ...

VSL products don't have anything to do with how you install your operating system - so if you don't like us to provide help or hints, just tell me - i will refuse to do so in future.

 

put someone familiar with computer setup in charge, tell him what you like to archive, complain there if not satisfied

christian

and remember: a CRAY is the only computer that runs an endless loop in just four hours ...
Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 19:11
by Chuck Green
Joined on Thu, Dec 21 2006, Ann Arbor, MI (USA), Posts 518

Thank's Christian.

Posted on Wed, Feb 18 2009 19:48
by bitmit
Joined on Mon, May 09 2005, Los Angeles, Posts 42
cm wrote:
i didn't say it will be easy to identify the components and moreover find the drivers then ...

Then I beg your pardon. That's how it looked to me

cm wrote:
VSL products don't have anything to do with how you install your operating system - so if you don't like us to provide help or hints, just tell me - i will refuse to do so in future.

Clearly I'm here to find advice. Operating systems are discussed here, in the context of how best to make the vienna library work. It's not in my interests to be on anything other than cordial terms with everyone on the forum, including the hosts. If in venting a little bit of frustration with a long process my tone offended then I apologize. I'd like to keep things appropriate here.

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