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Stuck Notes
Last post Thu, Jan 24 2019 by Doppler, 22 replies.
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Posted on Mon, Aug 16 2010 21:28
by mbeaumont
Joined on Sat, Mar 27 2010, Posts 11
Hello All,

Running a demo of VE Pro on a Salve Quad Core x64 Win7 Machine with 12 gig ram. The Slave host East West QL Symphonic Orchestra. I created an instance with 3 instuments. Over on the host a dell XPS Win 7 x32 running Notion connects to the slave OK. However I am getting stuck notes and random notes....

I am on a 1 Gigbit direct crossover LAN.

Any ideas?

Cheers
Mik
Posted on Sat, Aug 21 2010 05:38
by whinecellarstudio
Joined on Wed, Jun 06 2007, Nashville, TN, USA, Posts 105

Don't have an answer for you, but I'm finding the same issue on a new install.  I have VE Pro (64-bit servers) running on my Mac Pro (8 core Xeon with 16GB RAM) and 2 slaves: an iMac (3.03 GHz C2D with 8 GB RAM) and a 17" MacBook Pro (2.8 GHz C2D also with 8 GB RAM).  All 3 machines are tied to an ethernet switch via shielded cat6 cables.  I've been building this system slowly and I haven't seen any stuck notes until today... I just bought & installed LA Scoring Strings and that's where I noticed it, so it may be something to do with that - I'll have to dig into it further...

Jim Daneker
Whine Cellar Studio
www.whinecellarstudio.com
Posted on Tue, Aug 24 2010 14:21
by whinecellarstudio
Joined on Wed, Jun 06 2007, Nashville, TN, USA, Posts 105

Well, I found out my stuck note problems were to do with my MIDI patch bay (and possibly some LASS scripts) - all is well in VE Pro for me.

Jim Daneker
Whine Cellar Studio
www.whinecellarstudio.com
Posted on Sun, Sep 05 2010 16:17
by nicolas.soulat
Joined on Sat, Oct 02 2004, France, Posts 68

Hello

Same stuck notes probleme here with logic as DAW on a Mac Pro 8core.

Vienna library is used on a PC i7 920 with 12Go Ram within vienna ensemble pro 4.0.6150.

Every time i progam Runs (using legato patches from SE and SE plus)  on Woodwinds and play it together flute1,2; oboe1,2 clarinet1,2 bass clarinet basson1,2 i got random stuck note.

If i Playback only a section (for example only flutes) i don't have the issue it's only when all the instruments are trigerred with runs.

This is really bothering for the notes are played until i Pushed stop on logic.

Hope somebody would get an idea.

Thanks very much for helping;

Best regards,

Nicolas

Myspace :
www.myspace.com/outcastband
Official VideoClip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL9IAfJ58xk
Official Teaser for Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATK_E0Dau9I
"Elements" excerpt from upcoming album Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ8Kxf6TNA
Posted on Sun, Sep 05 2010 19:27
by nicolas.soulat
Joined on Sat, Oct 02 2004, France, Posts 68

Hello

For Logic Users, It seems to have some deals with regions... Two region paste identically (for example if two flutes have to play the same part and you don't want to create and edit two regions rewriting the same midi data on both) seems to make some eeries interferences and vienna ensemble acting like it receive the same datas twice on the same region (very difficult to exaplain)

any way I've just erased the flute 2, the clarinet 2 and the basson 2 in order to rewrite those separately (without copy paste region) and now i haven't any stuck note...

One word WEIRD...If someone has experienced it yet i'm relly looking forward to read them.

Many thanks,

Regards

Myspace :
www.myspace.com/outcastband
Official VideoClip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL9IAfJ58xk
Official Teaser for Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATK_E0Dau9I
"Elements" excerpt from upcoming album Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ8Kxf6TNA
Posted on Sun, Sep 05 2010 19:47
by nicolas.soulat
Joined on Sat, Oct 02 2004, France, Posts 68

Oops.

I spoke too fast..the problem is not solved i still have stuck notes randomly on each part containing fast runs...

I don't know what to do..

Regards;

Nicolas

Myspace :
www.myspace.com/outcastband
Official VideoClip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL9IAfJ58xk
Official Teaser for Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATK_E0Dau9I
"Elements" excerpt from upcoming album Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ8Kxf6TNA
Posted on Wed, Sep 08 2010 09:54
by nicolas.soulat
Joined on Sat, Oct 02 2004, France, Posts 68

Up!

I got the same problem writing for bras section :

2 Bb Trumpets

1 trumpets a3

1C trumpet

2 Ternor tbrnes

1 Bass trbne

On logic pro 9.1 if i Playback only the 2 trumpets => OK

the 2 trumpets and the "a3" section => OK

All the trumpets (including "C"one)=>OK

All The brasses except Bass Trbne=>OK

All the brasses=> KO i got stucked note on the VI keyboard on my slave PC randomly on trbnes or trumpets.

To sum up it's going well if i choose to playbak 3 or 4 regions but not well if I playback all.

For information I set the buffer size to 1024 (got a PCI motu 24 i/o).

This is very wierd for midi regions really seems to interfers together (althought these are not on the same midi channel) for example i tried to playback only the two Bb Trumpets all the keyswitches react well (if i look to the patch section on the VI the articulations change at the right time and the keyboard has not a single key stucked)

but

if I playback all my regions the articulation on my Bb Trumpet seems to be messed and I have keys stucked (most of the time this is always the same key wich is stucked)

Do you think this has something to do with polyphony? Buffer? The buffer on my core audio is on max and indeed if i Go back to 512 it goes worst.

I don't know what to do,

Anyway thanks for taking time reading this awfull post.

Best regards

Nicolas

Myspace :
www.myspace.com/outcastband
Official VideoClip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL9IAfJ58xk
Official Teaser for Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATK_E0Dau9I
"Elements" excerpt from upcoming album Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ8Kxf6TNA
Posted on Thu, Sep 09 2010 17:21
by gs_vsl
Joined on Sat, Jan 23 2010, Posts 48
I have had this problem also, ever since version 4.1.6776. The really annoying thing for me is that midi reset doesn't always fix it.

I especially notice the problem when using Cubase's chase feature. Basically, probably 20% of the time when I stop playback, I get hanging notes. I get less during normal playback, but they still occur.

This may be related to a bug I found previously where VE Pro loses midi messages when too many are sent simultaneously. I can recreate this with 100% consistency by loading a bunch of instruments in Kontakt (inside of VE Pro) with a midi monitor script. I then send CC messages from different tracks in Cubase to each instrument *at the same time*. I forget the exact number, but at some point, the later instruments do not receive the messages. It is not a Kontakt problem, because if I load Kontakt directly as a plugin in Cubase, all the instruments receive the messages.

My guess is that the hanging notes are cause by VE Pro missing note off messages when too many other things are occuring. This makes sense for the chase feature, where every time you stop playback, Cubase will reset all CCs on every track.

I send a reproducible test to support before, but they did not confirm it. I'll try again today. They have been very helpful in the past.
Posted on Thu, Sep 09 2010 17:26
by gs_vsl
Joined on Sat, Jan 23 2010, Posts 48
nicolas.soulat wrote:

Up!

To sum up it's going well if i choose to playbak 3 or 4 regions but not well if I playback all.



This also suggests that it is likely related to the issue of losing midi messages when too much is going on. If anyone has completely reproducible tests, it would probably be a good idea to send them to the support group.
Posted on Fri, Sep 10 2010 20:28
by gs_vsl
Joined on Sat, Jan 23 2010, Posts 48
I have ways of recreating the problem, but they are complex, which means few people will bother. Recreating the problem doesn't really help much if it takes 2 hours just to set up. Anyone have a simple example that always results in hanging notes?
Posted on Tue, Sep 14 2010 14:41
by Karel
Joined on Mon, Jan 19 2009, Belgium, Posts 2173

Do these stuck notes also occur when using 0 or 1 buffer of latency in the VE Pro Server Interface plugin?

Karel Bassez
Software Engineer
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Wed, Sep 15 2010 01:47
by gs_vsl
Joined on Sat, Jan 23 2010, Posts 48
I tried buffer settings of both 0 and 1 and it didn't help. There might have been slightly less hanging notes at lower buffer settings, but I didn't really test it enough to confidently make this conclusion.
Posted on Wed, Sep 15 2010 07:47
by nicolas.soulat
Joined on Sat, Oct 02 2004, France, Posts 68

Hello

I decided to go back from Logic 9.1 to cubase and i have no stucked notes anymore; don't konw if this is a common issue but it seems cubase handles much better orchestral mockups and templates than logic.

Therefore i only have one VEpro instance on my slave machine compared to the 4 opened when i was on Logic.

I keep logic for mix and audio editing but for Midi cubase is far better and much easy to use (folder tracks, midi port, several midi tracks editing in one windows...).

regards

Myspace :
www.myspace.com/outcastband
Official VideoClip
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RL9IAfJ58xk
Official Teaser for Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ATK_E0Dau9I
"Elements" excerpt from upcoming album Awaken The Reason
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuZ8Kxf6TNA
Posted on Wed, Sep 15 2010 12:50
by Cyril Blanc
Joined on Thu, Dec 19 2002, Paris France, Posts 2703

Hello/ salut Nicolas

Look if you dont have a loop in Midi.

There is a problem with IAC where you have to connect all the outputs of the "note input" object  to another object so it does not loop (a monitor ?? where  I am I dont have Logic )

Not sure but is there is not a midi out enable option in VE

I have 6 VE pro instance connected to Logic and I have no problem (80 instruments)

Best

Cyril

MacBook Pro 2019 16" + 2 x Odisseey G9 49" Big Sur

MacPro 2010 12 core 2.93 ghz 64 GB Mac OS X 10.11 2722 Rocket Raid Sata III card with 8 x ssd

Kbd : P80 Yamaha, S88 and S25 Komplete Kontrol, DX7
I-Controls Pro, 2xMidi expression pedals
Synth : many....
--
Logic X , Dorico, Band In A Box, ORB Composer
VSL : MIR PRO, Appassionata Strings I, Solo strings , Wind and Brass Complete, Dimension Brass, Big Band Orchestra series, Many Synchronised libs
Kontakt, Omnisphere, QLSO, QLSC, CS 80, Arturia V5, Maximo, Realivox Blue. CS 80 V3, The Orchestra 2, Art Conductor, Genesis Children Choir, Lunaris, Lacrimosa

Final Cut pro
Camera full HD
Posted on Sun, Sep 19 2010 13:05
by gs_vsl
Joined on Sat, Jan 23 2010, Posts 48
Cyril wrote:

Hello/ salut Nicolas

I have 6 VE pro instance connected to Logic and I have no problem (80 instruments)



Which version of VE Pro are you using? I had no stuck notes before 4.1, but now I have them all the time. I'd revert to 4.0 but 4.1 has a bug fix that is critical to my workflow.
Posted on Sun, Sep 19 2010 14:22
by Cyril Blanc
Joined on Thu, Dec 19 2002, Paris France, Posts 2703

i have t check this when i return from holidays

MacBook Pro 2019 16" + 2 x Odisseey G9 49" Big Sur

MacPro 2010 12 core 2.93 ghz 64 GB Mac OS X 10.11 2722 Rocket Raid Sata III card with 8 x ssd

Kbd : P80 Yamaha, S88 and S25 Komplete Kontrol, DX7
I-Controls Pro, 2xMidi expression pedals
Synth : many....
--
Logic X , Dorico, Band In A Box, ORB Composer
VSL : MIR PRO, Appassionata Strings I, Solo strings , Wind and Brass Complete, Dimension Brass, Big Band Orchestra series, Many Synchronised libs
Kontakt, Omnisphere, QLSO, QLSC, CS 80, Arturia V5, Maximo, Realivox Blue. CS 80 V3, The Orchestra 2, Art Conductor, Genesis Children Choir, Lunaris, Lacrimosa

Final Cut pro
Camera full HD
Posted on Fri, Oct 01 2010 21:57
by soundsgoodtome
Joined on Tue, Aug 03 2010, Posts 12
gs_vsl wrote:
midi reset doesn't always fix it.

i'm having the same problem (stuck notes), but i'm unclear what you mean by "midi reset."

are you referring to the standard command from your host sequencer (often called "all notes off")? or are you referring to a feature in ve pro? (i've searched the ve pro manual and haven't been able to find anything called "midi reset.")

i'm running dp7 on my primary machine (intel mac pro) and running ve pro on a 2nd intel mac pro. when i get stuck notes, i'm accustomed to sending an "all notes off" command, which is a standard part of the midi spec. but ve pro doesn't respond to it.


i'm curious whether ve pro's failure to respond to "all notes off" is a programming *omission* or if that functionality was included, but simply isn't working properly.
Posted on Fri, Oct 01 2010 22:27
by Karel
Joined on Mon, Jan 19 2009, Belgium, Posts 2173

VE Pro doesn't filter out any useful events. They are just passed to the instruments. If an "All notes off" message isn't working it's because the particular instrument doesn't handle it properly. Make sure to use the latest version of VE Pro by the way, as it has some potential improvement with regards to hanging notes.

Karel Bassez
Software Engineer
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sat, Oct 02 2010 11:29
by yt020490_13791
Joined on Wed, Apr 20 2005, Posts 40

For what it's worth...

When I first set up Logic and VEP I was getting quite a few pops glitches and hung notes until CRUCIALLY I disabled "Internet Sharing" in the OSX system preferences. I was using it to pass the internet connection from my master machine to the slave. But it seemed to f***k everything up. Now all our slaves are running totally offline with only one LAN connection for VEP running on its very own LAN cable with nothing else going down that cable.

We're running 2 slaves systems on Mac Pros with logic, running 240 tracks of (currently) Kontakt 4.1.1, Omnisphere, Massive, FXPansion Sysnthsquad. And they're really running pretty much flawlessly.

In our Logic template I've used the environment to add a special MIDI track for the very infrequent occasions when I get a hung note... This track has all note data removed (using transformers in the environment), and then passes everything else to EVERY midi channel on EVERY VEP instance (routed in the environment)!! This way, if there's ever a hung note, I just unmute the "all notes off" CC message which I keep in Bar -2 on this special "all VEP slaves" MIDI track, and BAM, it's gone. I also use this special "All VEP" track to send Modulation and Pitch Bend resets at the very start of every cue. This way if there's missing dynamics programming on a track, at least the playback results are always consistent.

(Very, very occasionally, I do have an issue with some Kontakt patches hanging _within_ Kontakt. This isn't cured by sending an "all notes off" message. I'm pretty sure this is in fact a bug in Kontakt, or possibly a bug in the scripting of specific patches. Although having said that, I don't think I've ever seen this behaviour when running Kontakt straight in Logic, so it may be related in some way to hosting Kontakt inside VEP. None the less, I've only experienced this maybe 2 times in 3 months, so it's no biggie.)

More useful info for Logic users... I find the following latency settings work best for us:

Audio Buffer: 128 or 256 samples (can be increased during mixing if necessary)

Process Buffer Range: Medium

VEP AU host Latency: 2 buffers

and one last thing. ALL professional Logic users MUST read this thread on the Apples forums about how the currently selected track in the arrange window is in "Live Input Mode" and the entired signal chain for that track runs on CPU core 8...

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3161

Peace out... and community forums FTW!

Will Rice

p.p. Sheridan Tongue

Posted on Mon, Mar 07 2016 08:41
by snattack
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2008, Piteå, Sweden, Posts 68

Originally Posted by: yt020490_13791 Go to Quoted Post

For what it's worth...

When I first set up Logic and VEP I was getting quite a few pops glitches and hung notes until CRUCIALLY I disabled "Internet Sharing" in the OSX system preferences. I was using it to pass the internet connection from my master machine to the slave. But it seemed to f***k everything up. Now all our slaves are running totally offline with only one LAN connection for VEP running on its very own LAN cable with nothing else going down that cable.

We're running 2 slaves systems on Mac Pros with logic, running 240 tracks of (currently) Kontakt 4.1.1, Omnisphere, Massive, FXPansion Sysnthsquad. And they're really running pretty much flawlessly.

In our Logic template I've used the environment to add a special MIDI track for the very infrequent occasions when I get a hung note... This track has all note data removed (using transformers in the environment), and then passes everything else to EVERY midi channel on EVERY VEP instance (routed in the environment)!! This way, if there's ever a hung note, I just unmute the "all notes off" CC message which I keep in Bar -2 on this special "all VEP slaves" MIDI track, and BAM, it's gone. I also use this special "All VEP" track to send Modulation and Pitch Bend resets at the very start of every cue. This way if there's missing dynamics programming on a track, at least the playback results are always consistent.

(Very, very occasionally, I do have an issue with some Kontakt patches hanging _within_ Kontakt. This isn't cured by sending an "all notes off" message. I'm pretty sure this is in fact a bug in Kontakt, or possibly a bug in the scripting of specific patches. Although having said that, I don't think I've ever seen this behaviour when running Kontakt straight in Logic, so it may be related in some way to hosting Kontakt inside VEP. None the less, I've only experienced this maybe 2 times in 3 months, so it's no biggie.)

More useful info for Logic users... I find the following latency settings work best for us:

Audio Buffer: 128 or 256 samples (can be increased during mixing if necessary)

Process Buffer Range: Medium

VEP AU host Latency: 2 buffers

and one last thing. ALL professional Logic users MUST read this thread on the Apples forums about how the currently selected track in the arrange window is in "Live Input Mode" and the entired signal chain for that track runs on CPU core 8...

http://support.apple.com/kb/HT3161

Peace out... and community forums FTW!

Will Rice

p.p. Sheridan Tongue

 

A couple of years later: I have this issue, still. It only affects Kontakt, and occures when stopping playback (seems random), which makes Kontakt internally hang notes, which can only be removed by pressing "Mute" INSIDE Kontakt. This is a real pain in the ***, I'm having to VNC into the Slaves and find the correct patch EVERYTIME this happen, since the Mute-button inside Kontakt can't be assigned to any midi-command.

PLEASE; can someone suggest what the hell this bug is about? This affects all my 3 slave computers, so it's not system specific on the VEP Server side.

Logic Pro 10.2.1, OSX Maverick, Mac Pro 2013 8-core, 64GB Ram, 3 different slave setups, everything SSD.

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