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Hearing two instruments with velocity x-fade
Last post Mon, Feb 21 2011 by DG, 9 replies.
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Posted on Sat, Feb 19 2011 09:52
by DaveTubaKing
Joined on Fri, Feb 27 2004, London, Posts 770

When creating subtle dynamic changes, in this case with the solo violin perf-legato patch, how do people avoid the problem that you can distinctly hear the two intsruments during x-fade. Here's an example of the problem. And heres the score for that.

How do you create subtle changes in dynamic whilst avoiding hearing the dynamic levels cross fade.

David Carter https://sorabjiorchestralmusic.wordpress.com/
https://www.youtube.com/...UCoEithAEjsd4IBViwsfQFwQ

W10 Pro (64bit), Z390 Aorus Pro wifi MB, Intel i7-8700K s.7 GHz, Corsair 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 3000MHz, Samsung 970 EVO M.2, 2 x OCZ Agility 3 480GB SSDs, Sibelius 8.4.1, Symphonic cube, VEPro7, MIRPro, Focustite Scarlett Solo, Nvidia GeForce GT 710 2GB GDDR5
Posted on Sat, Feb 19 2011 12:03
by gerard kruse
Joined on Sat, Apr 25 2009, Leiden, The Netherlands, Posts 105

The responses I got on a similar finding 2 years ago was to avoid the combination of the notes or to tweek the transition depending the instrument (I had a thing with the download fr oboe).

Gerard

Posted on Sat, Feb 19 2011 16:52
by Peregrine
Joined on Sun, May 28 2006, Scottsdale, Arizona, Posts 59

 I don't see a DAW listed, but for one thing, you can try Cubase 6, use note expression and get rid of the cross fade.

Two, you could put the accented note on a separate track, assuming that's where you're having the problem.

Three, you'd have to do some elemental work with a wave form editor - kind of time consuming.

regards,

Ray

Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 14:43
by Feenixx
Joined on Wed, Aug 25 2010, Ireland, Posts 68

I found I could not get veloicity crossfade to work the way I would have expected. Using Expression (mapped tro CC 11 in VI pro) hgas solved all my problems.

Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 17:52
by DaveTubaKing
Joined on Fri, Feb 27 2004, London, Posts 770

Thanks people.

Feenix, isn't using CC11 simply increasing the volume of the sample so that if, on a single p sustained sample, you increase CC11 aren't you just increasing the volume of the p patch. It's difficult to explain but if you have a two second note starting p cresc to mf which then moves to another 2 second not starting mf decresc to p. If you use CC11 you simply increase the volume of the P patch and then move to an mf patch and decrease the volume of that patch. There qill be an audible difference between the timbre of each patch. Ideally I want to use a dynamic patch where the cresc/decresc is recorded into the patch but, inevitably even with VSL, there's only so many of those they can record and they don't fit all situations by a long shot.

Also isn't expression and volume the same thing whatever CC theyre assigned to.

Anyway i shall experiment with expression.

David Carter https://sorabjiorchestralmusic.wordpress.com/
https://www.youtube.com/...UCoEithAEjsd4IBViwsfQFwQ

W10 Pro (64bit), Z390 Aorus Pro wifi MB, Intel i7-8700K s.7 GHz, Corsair 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 3000MHz, Samsung 970 EVO M.2, 2 x OCZ Agility 3 480GB SSDs, Sibelius 8.4.1, Symphonic cube, VEPro7, MIRPro, Focustite Scarlett Solo, Nvidia GeForce GT 710 2GB GDDR5
Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 18:51
by Feenixx
Joined on Wed, Aug 25 2010, Ireland, Posts 68
DaveTubaKing wrote:

...

Also isn't expression and volume the same thing whatever CC theyre assigned to.

...

I'm not exactly a MIDI guru - as far as I can see, if I use Expression, then I can still adjust or automate the volume of the track in my mixer, in addition to the use of Expression. If I use Volume, then the track volume is automated, and I cannot adjust it any longer, without going through an auxillary track... which can get complex and confusing with a large score.

Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 19:17
by DG
Joined on Wed, May 12 2004, Posts 8608

Both CC7 and CC11 can be used to do the same thing. However, think of Expression as exactly that; a way to create little ebbs and flows within a melodic line. Volume is really for mixing. You will find that if you set Volume to something less than 127, Expression will just work in 127ths of whatever you set Volume to, thereby giving the impression of smaller increments.

The only sequencer that I know of that can cause a problem with using both Expression and Volume is Logic.

DG

Nuendo 6.03, 4.3
2 x Intel Xeon x5675 3.07GHz Hex Core
48GB RAM
Windows 7 (x64)Pro
RME Multiface II
Intensity
ATI HD5400 series graphics card
Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 19:26
by DaveTubaKing
Joined on Fri, Feb 27 2004, London, Posts 770

Thanks DG more to experiment with. I'm doing all this in sibelius. So if I set C7 to 100 using C11 I have 127 increments above C7100.

David Carter https://sorabjiorchestralmusic.wordpress.com/
https://www.youtube.com/...UCoEithAEjsd4IBViwsfQFwQ

W10 Pro (64bit), Z390 Aorus Pro wifi MB, Intel i7-8700K s.7 GHz, Corsair 64GB (4x16GB) DDR4 3000MHz, Samsung 970 EVO M.2, 2 x OCZ Agility 3 480GB SSDs, Sibelius 8.4.1, Symphonic cube, VEPro7, MIRPro, Focustite Scarlett Solo, Nvidia GeForce GT 710 2GB GDDR5
Posted on Mon, Feb 21 2011 23:08
by DG
Joined on Wed, May 12 2004, Posts 8608

127 increments within that 100. However, it still gives you some headroom for mixing with the rest of the instruments.

DG

Nuendo 6.03, 4.3
2 x Intel Xeon x5675 3.07GHz Hex Core
48GB RAM
Windows 7 (x64)Pro
RME Multiface II
Intensity
ATI HD5400 series graphics card
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