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Wow, what's that patch?
Last post Wed, Feb 08 2012 by Vanhapolle, 48 replies.
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Posted on Sun, Nov 20 2011 19:45
by jammusique
Joined on Wed, Aug 04 2004, Paris, France, Posts 259

Watching the new VIP2 videos, in the APPS overview at 8'15", Paul says "the second violins", and I see a patch in the second slot called "51Vl-14B_perf legato"!   Hmmmm...... Hmm

WW complete. MirX Teldex, Cubase, PC
Posted on Sun, Nov 20 2011 20:23
by C.B.
Joined on Wed, Aug 11 2010, Quebec Canada, Posts 127

Hi jammusique,

That seems to be a nice surprise when upgrading to VIP2.

Yesterday, I discovered that my violons (Solo, Chambers and Orchestra) have now theese welcome articulations collections. 



New patches? Transposition on the fly (like divisi technique) ? Paul or any else at VSL?

Claude

C.B.
Posted on Mon, Nov 21 2011 15:30
by herb
Joined on Mon, Aug 05 2002, Posts 4621

 Yes, these are new Violin2 patches for the string collections.

We didn't list this as a prime feature. These patches are based on existing wav content, just semitone transposed.

We had to do prepare  a lot of Library Update content anyway,  therefor we included these patches as extra bonus.

best

Herb

Posted on Mon, Nov 21 2011 19:05
by C.B.
Joined on Wed, Aug 11 2010, Quebec Canada, Posts 127

"Not a prime feature".

Certainly a very very useful feature ! Smile

Thanks a lot Herb (ans all others at Vienna team) !

CB

C.B.
Posted on Mon, Nov 21 2011 21:34
by Fiery Angel
Joined on Mon, Nov 07 2005, Milton ON, Posts 311

Does this apply only to the full Orchestral Strings or also Orchestra Strings from Vienna SE?

I don't have the full ORchestra Strings though I do own Appassionata full.  

David

I compose therefore I am.
Posted on Tue, Nov 22 2011 19:42
by stevetrumpet
Joined on Thu, Jan 24 2008, United Kingdom, Posts 178

That's so useful VSL - cheers!

Any chance you can do it for the SE strings?? Please?

Steve

Posted on Fri, Nov 25 2011 10:37
by kage49
Joined on Fri, Dec 05 2008, Posts 35

Maybe someone can help me here... Where are these new patches exactly? I've updated the libraries (I can see the new matricies) but can't find any of the transposed patches. Am I missing something?

Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2011 15:32
by C.B.
Joined on Wed, Aug 11 2010, Quebec Canada, Posts 127

Hi kage49,

You'll find them on the VIP2's PATCH section (not the MATRIX section). Exemple for Violons orchestra: 

  • A- Strings patches
    • Violons Orchestra
      • 90 VIOLONS 2
      • 91 VIOLONS 2ext

CB

C.B.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2011 18:14
by kage49
Joined on Fri, Dec 05 2008, Posts 35

Thanks!

Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2011 20:16
by Oceanview
Joined on Sat, Jan 12 2008, Oxford, England, Posts 159

Two questions:

Can these patches be used by people using Sibelius 7?

Also, can someone explain how to do the 'second violin' trick of transposing a second violin in Solo Strings up a semitone and then lowering the part to concert pitch to avoid phasing when playing unison phrases with the first violin? I'm working with Sibelius 7, VIPro 2 and the Solo Strings. I don't have a keyboard, so instructions I've previously read such as 'use the mod-wheel to lower to concert pitch' doesn't mean anything. How I do this in VIPro 2? Presumably I use Sibelius to transpose the entire part up a semitone and something in VIPro 2 to bring it back down - but for an entire matrix. Can anyone clarify this? Thanks.

Actually just wanted to add a real thanks to the Vienna team for 'auto humanize' and for the names of cells in VIPro 2.

Oceanview
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2011 21:01
by C.B.
Joined on Wed, Aug 11 2010, Quebec Canada, Posts 127

Hi Oceanview 

Don't know for Sibelius.

But, these patches are usable as it. No transposition technique (modwheel, etc.) tu use at all.

If I understand Herb's answer, they builded them from standard Violon (and other strings) patches. 

CB

C.B.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2011 21:50
by Oceanview
Joined on Sat, Jan 12 2008, Oxford, England, Posts 159

Thanks C.B. Yes I understand that the new patches have already been prepared by transposing for second violin but if they do not work with Sibelius presets then I have to know about the other method. And I want to know about the other method so I can apply it to my playback configurations.

Oceanview
Posted on Mon, Nov 28 2011 02:27
by noldar12
Joined on Thu, Dec 04 2008, Posts 582

Oceanview, that is how it works.  After the piece is completed:

1: Transpose the 2nd violin part up (or down) a half step in Sibelius (I use Finale, so can't precisely say the exact command).

2: Do a MIDI continuous events command for the modwheel of the 2nd violins, to bring the part back to correct concert pitch.  The default maximum modwheel adjustment in the older VI Pro is one whole step.  That can easily be changed to a half step if desired.

Posted on Mon, Nov 28 2011 13:03
by Oceanview
Joined on Sat, Jan 12 2008, Oxford, England, Posts 159

Noldar12, thanks for your comment. But how do I 'do a MIDI continuous events command' in VIPro 2? And that applies to an entire matrix or preset?

Oceanview
Posted on Mon, Nov 28 2011 18:43
by stevetrumpet
Joined on Thu, Jan 24 2008, United Kingdom, Posts 178

Oceanview - just use the normal sibelius preset for violin and then copy the new violin 2 patches into the relevant cells 

I guess you can then save the preset as violin 2 so you don't have to do it each time!

Steve 

Posted on Mon, Nov 28 2011 22:31
by Steve Martin
Joined on Sat, Sep 17 2005, Queensland, Australia, Posts 552

Hi Herb,

thanks for the Violin 2 material. That's fantastic! Yes

best,

SteveBig Smile

Posted on Mon, Nov 28 2011 23:28
by noldar12
Joined on Thu, Dec 04 2008, Posts 582

Oceanview, the continuous command for the mod wheel is done in the score part itself, not in VI Pro.  VI Pro is simply set up to receive the command (the default for the mod wheel in VI Pro is a whole step).  Thus, in your score, in the 2nd violin part, setting the mod wheel to +8191 (the max adjustment up IIRC), will raise the pitch of the part a whole step when played back (again, if the default in VI Pro is left at a whole step, i.e. 200 cents), bringing the pitch of the transposed part back up to correct concert pitch (example: score in E major, transposed 2 violin part moved down to D major, with mod wheel adjustment sounding in E major, using samples a whole step lower than the first violins).

If you end up getting VI Pro 2, using the 2 violin parts in VI Pro 2 would be the far simpler way to go, as all the needed adjustments would automatically be done for you behind the scene as it were, without the need of any manual adjustments on your part.

Posted on Tue, Nov 29 2011 12:41
by Oceanview
Joined on Sat, Jan 12 2008, Oxford, England, Posts 159

Noldar, thanks for your reply. I hope you are not going to think me obtuse, but in Sibelius there is no way I am aware to adjust modwheel - in fact, in terms of Sibelius I'm not sure the term has any meaning at all. You said, 'setting the mod wheel to +8191 (the max adjustment up IIRC)' - how would I do that inside Sibelius? It isn't a sequencer like Logic or Cubase. The 'score' is not piano-roll style but only conventional music notation. I have no idea what that would mean in Sibelius. And what is IIRC?

Steve, thanks for that suggestion. I thought that might not work because of soundsets, but I see now if the articulations replace the usual ones they should get triggered anyway. I'll try it.

But even so I 'd like to understand what Noldar is suggesting.

Oceanview
Posted on Tue, Nov 29 2011 17:02
by noldar12
Joined on Thu, Dec 04 2008, Posts 582

Oceanview, unfortunately, I cannot talk Sibelius specifically, as I use Finale (and actually primarily an old version: 2005).  I would think that something similar would be available in Sibelius to the following: in Finale, there is a separate icon for MIDI control/commands.  One of the commands allows you to set data for continuous controllers - in this case selecting the mod wheel.  By clicking on the part you wish to edit, a MIDI display for the mod wheel for the particular part in the score that you selected is opened.  One can highlight an area where the mod wheel control data is to start (best done in a rest prior to the start of the score), and then set the continuous controller data accordingly.  Since the data is continuous, setting it for that one brief moment is all that is needed.

Note that in general doing MIDI edits in a notation program is very cumbersome, and MIDI edits are generally best done in a sequencer.  This sort of mod wheel command would be an exception.

Posted on Wed, Nov 30 2011 08:57
by Oceanview
Joined on Sat, Jan 12 2008, Oxford, England, Posts 159

Thanks Noldar. I guess I can ask at the Sibelius forum also.

I've had a look at the violin 2 cells - looks like VSL chose 14 without and 14 with mutes - presumably the articulations they thought would be most likely used. I'd like to second the earlier request that we might have these (or larger) for the Special Edition and SE Plus.

Oceanview
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