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Posted on Sat, Dec 28 2013 05:44
by rosindabow
Joined on Tue, Dec 18 2007, Posts 65

I have been running VE Pro and this is the first time that I've truly loaded up my 64bit server. It's all on one computer at the moment and I've got a combination of VSL Pro Insturments and other Software synthesizers including a couple of Kontakts and a few Spectrasonics tracks.  I am now getting this message: "Your system is low on free memory. It is recommended to abort loading to avoid system instability."  I ignore it and everything seems to be okay - but it is definitely running sluggishly.  Are there optimum setting for both the Ensemble Pro as well as for Kontakt and Play so that they can all live together in harmony?

There is a secondary issue as well - when I save the project, I usually save it couple inside the session ... but I have tried decoupling it to see if the performance improved.  There was no noticable change however, there was a tremednouly challenging time re-opening the file.  I always start up my VE Pros prior to laucnhing MOTU's Digital Performer, but whne I de-coupled the project - it wanted to open up two versions fo the preset, whci I'm sure contributed to the memory issues.  This has always been one of the challenging aspects in using VSL.  I am never quite sure how best to save and open projects.  I seem to always default back to copling everything together as I know that when I re-opne the file, it will ultimately be as I left it.  It may take 10 minutes to open, but at least it opens as it was the day before.  Any other suggestiosn as to better organize all of this?

I know this is a two-part question ... the forst part is what I need answered asap.  The second can wait a bit.  Thanks in advance.

2 x 3.06 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon. MOTU's Digital Performer 10, Pro Tools, Logic Pro. VSL libraries, Waves, UAudio, PspAudioware, Spectrasonics, etc ...
Posted on Sat, Dec 28 2013 16:07
by Paul
Joined on Sat, Aug 03 2002, Vienna, Posts 12746

Hi, 

1) How much RAM are you actually using (you can check in the Activity Monitor, for each application)? 

To get best performance in streaming and RAM consumption, you should get SSD drives in combination with VI PRO (you can load smaller junks of samples into RAM, increasing the Load time and decreasing the RAM consumtion, "Preload". I see that you are using VI PRO already!).

2) Can you explain again what your current system is? Maybe it will help to play through the scenario described in the VE PRO 5 manual, pages 32-34

Best, 

Paul

Paul Kopf
Product Manager - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sat, Dec 28 2013 16:52
by rosindabow
Joined on Tue, Dec 18 2007, Posts 65

I will check the amount of RAM per application later today (off to a gig now).  Does the dedicated threads per isntance have something to do with this?  I think that I upped it to 6 threads and I have at least two open.  Should I bring that back down to 2 each?

As far as the current system: I'm running a Mac Desktop Pro with 16Gbs of memory.  I have a tone of hard drives including 4 internal drives and at least 10 external drives, all running off Firewire 800 ports. I have 2 firewire 800 hubs.  The VSL samplea are on their own dedicated external hard drive.  I am running Digital Performer 8.05 on OS 10.8.5.

Part of what's confusing, even while re-reading the manual, is the difference between coupled and preserved and why would one use one and not the other.  And also, what is save witht the session.  And why does one open up with the session - and when I want to not use the blank one and attempt to open up what I think is a preserved instance, it now creates two instances of VS E Pro. And forget about the metaframe ...

Thanks for the quick response.

2 x 3.06 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon. MOTU's Digital Performer 10, Pro Tools, Logic Pro. VSL libraries, Waves, UAudio, PspAudioware, Spectrasonics, etc ...
Posted on Sun, Dec 29 2013 04:29
by Cyril Blanc
Joined on Thu, Dec 19 2002, Paris France, Posts 2686

16 Gb is a bit small nowdays !

32 or 64 gb is recommanded, specialy with bit templates

Do you run other apps than VSL and Digital performer ? if yes quit them !

You did not chose the best solution in buying 2x Firewire 800 hubs, a eSata card would have been better.

How many empty HD do you have ? what size ?

A no cost solution is to put your 4 internal HD in a Raid 0 and put your VSL libs on them (have a backup of the raid 0 on another big HD)

You can put one HD under the DVD with your system

This will allow to reduce the preload buffer size in "Directory manager" a little bit

But the best solution is to get a SATA III card with 4 x sata ports and SSD and build a raid 0 to put your VSL libs, with 2,3 or 4 ssd

This will allow to reduce the preload buffer size in "Directory manager" down to 1,5k

MacBook Pro 2019 16" + 2 x Odisseey G9 49" Big Sur
MacPro 2010 12 core 2.93 ghz 64 GB Mac OS X 10.11 2722 Rocket Raid Sata III card with 8 x ssd
VSL lib on a Raid 0 of 4 x 256 GB ssd Sata III - Raid 0 of 4 x 64 GB for other libs
System on a 1 TB ssd
Audio Motu PCI system 84 ins / 64 outs
Kbd : P80 Yamaha, S88 and S25 Komplete Kontrol, DX7
I-Controls Pro, 2xMidi expression pedals
Synth : many....
---
Macbook pro Retina 2.7 ghz 16 GB
---
Mac Mini server 10.10 (server, Itunes, WEB, and Backup )
--
Logic X , Dorico, Band In A Box, ORB Composer
VSL : MIR PRO, Appassionata Strings I, Solo strings , Wind and Brass Complete, Dimension Brass, Big Band Orchestra series
Kontakt, Omnisphere, QLSO, QLSC, CS 80, Arturia V5, Maximo, Realivox Blue. CS 80 V3, The Orchestra 2, Art Conductor 5, Genesis Children Choir, Lunaris, Lacrimosa

Final Cut pro
Camera full HD
Posted on Sun, Dec 29 2013 09:32
by rosindabow
Joined on Tue, Dec 18 2007, Posts 65

At the moment, I am not going to expand the memory in this system as I am eagerly awaiting the new Mac Desktop Pro.  I have over 30 hard drives in my studio ranging in size from 500Gbs to 2Tb.  My computer is full up with PCie cards - a MOTU card, a UAD card, and one other which I cannot remember right now, and my studio is off for the evening. suffice it to say, I have no room for any other cards.  I run many apps other than VSL and Digital Performer, including Kontakt, Play, Spectrasonics, AltiVerb, etc ... I do not exclusively run VSL instruments, though I love them.  This is the first time in 15 years that I've ever experienced so many dropouts. And I have been able to isolate it to me loading up my VE Ensemble Pro with VSL instruements as well as other plugins.  I watched my acticvity monitor while I was working and VSL was hogging everything.  I slowly and methodically moved things out of the Ensemble Pro and put them into a V-Rack inside DP as separate instruments and voilá, the dropouts stopped.  VSL began to hog less of the memory and DP took more ... but everything began to run more smoothly.  I also noticed that when playing the movie along side the session, DP need about 15% more CPU. I have the movie on a separate hard drive, I never thought that the movie itslef would need so much CPU ...

I will eventually move into SSD drives but I've never bought into the idea of a RAID.  I just like larger single drives with greater access speed. I have had bad experience with one bad drive in the RAID messing up the entire system - never liked them.

I will also get a lot more memory in my new computer, whenever that is .... hopefully within the new year.

One other question: would the system drive benefit from an SSD?  Does that need any speed to access the applications or is it only material that needs the speed?  What about the record drives?  I've never had an issue with Firewire 2 and I've had 100 plus tracks running nice and smooth.  I never record at a higher rate than 48K, 24bit - that seems to me to be the best bang for the buck.

Thanks for writing back, it's been an interesting couple of days figuring this all out.

2 x 3.06 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon. MOTU's Digital Performer 10, Pro Tools, Logic Pro. VSL libraries, Waves, UAudio, PspAudioware, Spectrasonics, etc ...
Posted on Mon, Dec 30 2013 07:01
by Cyril Blanc
Joined on Thu, Dec 19 2002, Paris France, Posts 2686
rosindabow wrote:

I will eventually move into SSD drives but I've never bought into the idea of a RAID.  I just like larger single drives with greater access speed. I have had bad experience with one bad drive in the RAID messing up the entire system - never liked them.

If you put your VSL lib on a Raid 0, you will increase the I/O by 1.5 by disk.

A Raid 0 is to be read. You just need to back it up on a big HD in case it fails

For example you NEVER put your system disk on a Raid 0.

To put your system disk on a SSD will only increase the starting of your Mac and the starting of an app

You will gain a lot putting your VSL lib on a SSD.

MacBook Pro 2019 16" + 2 x Odisseey G9 49" Big Sur
MacPro 2010 12 core 2.93 ghz 64 GB Mac OS X 10.11 2722 Rocket Raid Sata III card with 8 x ssd
VSL lib on a Raid 0 of 4 x 256 GB ssd Sata III - Raid 0 of 4 x 64 GB for other libs
System on a 1 TB ssd
Audio Motu PCI system 84 ins / 64 outs
Kbd : P80 Yamaha, S88 and S25 Komplete Kontrol, DX7
I-Controls Pro, 2xMidi expression pedals
Synth : many....
---
Macbook pro Retina 2.7 ghz 16 GB
---
Mac Mini server 10.10 (server, Itunes, WEB, and Backup )
--
Logic X , Dorico, Band In A Box, ORB Composer
VSL : MIR PRO, Appassionata Strings I, Solo strings , Wind and Brass Complete, Dimension Brass, Big Band Orchestra series
Kontakt, Omnisphere, QLSO, QLSC, CS 80, Arturia V5, Maximo, Realivox Blue. CS 80 V3, The Orchestra 2, Art Conductor 5, Genesis Children Choir, Lunaris, Lacrimosa

Final Cut pro
Camera full HD
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