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Apologies to the forum
Last post Tue, Nov 07 2017 by Craig, 24 replies.
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Posted on Thu, Nov 02 2017 21:51
by Guy Bacos
Joined on Sun, Jan 16 2005, Quebec, Canada, Posts 1986

I'd like to apologize to the people of the forum and moderators regarding the couple of threads with the heated exchanges. Noone requested I apologize or said anything about it, I just want to let people know that this should not be a reflection of me, and I think people knows this, and although I firmly maintain my opinions, I should of quit after the point was made before the discussion got out of hand.

VSL has a classy forum and I'd like to be respectful to how it should be, also as a VSL demo maker.

Thanks,

Guy

Posted on Thu, Nov 02 2017 22:11
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Göttingen, Posts 953

Originally Posted by: Guy Bacos Go to Quoted Post

VSL is a classy forum and I'd like to be respectful to how it should be, also as a VSL demo maker.

Thanks,

Guy

I do completly consent with you. And I am sure if ever you learn to also respect the one who answers you may be even something you are not so familiar with, than I am sure we both will continue to keep the quality of this forum as we both want it to be.

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3648 mp3 with a whole Week (=7 Days /=171 hours) of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de
a) ...Synchron-Strings explored in 40 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Strings.

b) ...Synchron-Steinway explored in 48 mp3 with nearly three hours of complete and ambitious scores from 18th 19th 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Steinway.
Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 02:53
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5512

Guy has nothing to apologize for.  He is a brilliant, tremendously skilled creator of music.  He has made an art out of demos that no other website for sample libraries has.  He creates beautiful tone poems and brilliant miniatures instead of just routine demos. And he does the most perfect performances and mixes of these with his great skill as a pianist and MIDI performer. I am amazed by his work, and inspired.

fahl5 - YOU are the one who should be apologizing.  You are the most arrogant person this Forum has ever seen - Evan Evans was the previous contender.  You top him.  You should be permanently banned.  

Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 04:06
by agitato
Joined on Mon, Jun 22 2015, Posts 389

Agree with William.

Guy,

you didnt have to apologize, but you still did. The only thing Ive seen you do here is to post the highest quality works that inspire all of us, while all that I (for one) do is banter about music. 

Fahl, 

Maybe there is some issue with your communicating in English, but your response to Guy sounded rude and uncalled for. Guy wasnt lecturing you or anyone, but apologizing to all of us (for no valid reason). But in your response you seem to give him advice on how to behave ('learn to respect?'). Thats the way it comes across. 

Sorry I felt the need to point this out when I read you response.

I hope you continue your good work on sampling classical works and keep us posted on it. Music is the only reason we are here isnt it?  

Hope we can all move on.

Best Wishes

Anand

Anand Kumar
Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 11:00
by jasensmith
Joined on Tue, Jan 15 2008, Arizona, Posts 1572

Guy,

You have been on the forum long enough to remember the "Tumultuous Years." 

Back when Dietz was shutting threads down left and right; around two a day at its worst.  They would start innocently enough but would soon degenerate into heated back and forths and SHOUTING matches

I'm sure MIR would have been released a year earlier if poor Dietz didn't have to waste so much time chiding us unruly children and shutting down our acidulous threads.  There should have been a lot of apologizing from a lot of forum members back then.

But things have changed.  In fact, I can't remember the last time Dietz had to shut a thread down

Anyway, of all people on this forum you would be the last one to have to apologize for anything.  In fact, I'm feeling a little ashamed right now.  If Guy Bacos is apologizing for something then I should be on my knees begging for forgiveness for my past forum sins. 


"If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. There's no point in being a damn fool about it."
- W.C. Fields
Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 15:28
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5512

That is true Jason.   I should have been incarcerated and caused Dietz a lot of trouble.  But Guy apologized because he is a gentleman as well as a great musician.  As he stated previously, it is best to just spend time on music.  

Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 18:00
by Jos Wylin
Joined on Mon, Dec 03 2012, Belgium, Posts 594

William, Jasen, Anand,

I can't but agree with you. Let's move on and make music. This I've repeated a couple of times and don't forget that a little bit of humor can sometimes work miracles...

(I joined this forum in 2012, far from the starting period. I'm glad I didn't have to live that period you mentioned.)

Jos

http://www.joswyl.be
compositions and sampling exercises
Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 21:06
by synergy543
Joined on Fri, Apr 01 2005, Posts 132

Originally Posted by: fahl5 Go to Quoted Post
I do completly consent with you. And I am sure if ever you learn to also respect the one who answers you may be even something you are not so familiar with, than I am sure we both will continue to keep the quality of this forum as we both want it to be.

Steffen, Guy has honorably stepped up to the plate here to apologies even when he had nothing to apologize for.  Yet, you continue to attack him even here. 

Isn't it time for reconciliation here so we can all get back to discussing about music?

In all honesty, I think if you go back and re-read what Guy wrote you'll find some helpful advice from someone with a tremendous amount of experience using VSL instruments.  What he shared with you could be very helpful if you take his comments with a positive attitude in the spirt of musicians helping musicians.  In no way did I read Guy's comments any other way.  Whether you agree or not, maybe its just time to chill for a bit so we can all move on and get back to discussing music.

Greg (Gregory D. Moore)
Posted on Fri, Nov 03 2017 22:52
by FabioA
Joined on Fri, Jan 13 2012, Posts 89

I just hope Guy will not decide to avoid comments, feedbacks, tips and suggestions on the next works that users will post on the forum, because it would be a bad loss for us.

Posted on Sat, Nov 04 2017 02:32
by Errikos
Joined on Tue, Jun 12 2007, Posts 1061

Guy is a respected composer and member here, a consummate professional in every respect, and if he feels he has to apologise for anything (I haven't even followed the discussion in question since I only dicovered it through this thread and most posts have been deleted, so I am unaware of the specific alleged transgressions), of course he can do so at his volition, and it is none of my business.

Being a member myself from almost day one here - and one that has exhibited zen-like serenity while surrounded by formidable volcanic activity (and mild folly) through the years, and one who has barely raised the forum's mercury and only on occasion with some carefully chosen admonitions and timid suggestions, I would like to hereby offer an alternative viewpoint than those already in evidence, if I may.

Those familiar with my posts perhaps already suspect that I loathe political correctness with a primordial, unbridled passion. I foam at the mouth when I sense people's muscles tightening in conversation (in true Pavlovian fashion), when the "wrong" thing is mentioned, in the "wrong" way, whatever it is.

We are supposed to be the free spirits - a necessary quality that, among other things, allows us access to those realms inaccessible to others. Not corporate cogs of a machine that have to stipulate to pre-ordained 'codes' of conduct. In addition, I believe that true composers are not cry-babies  - "Mooooom!! This other boy said something NASTY to me, and hurt my over-sensitive feelings....*pout*"

Personally, I've exchanged ICBMs with fahl (and others), and have formed my own opinion; actually he was the one back in the day that was pleading with Dietz to expel me from the forum(!!), so he would be the first to disagree with what I assert here!

Be that as it may, I would never ask for an apology (irrespective of whether I would get it or not), either from him, or Gianna (memories...), or anybody else. I am even carrying a discussion right now with fahl in that other great thread. Have we really become so '21st century'? Maybe that's another reason why music today is going nowhere...

Like I said, I would never presume to dictate or expect of Guy or fahl, or anybody else how to behave . Have a look at how Haendel, Bach, Mozart, Beethoven, Berlioz, Wagner, Stravinsky, or Boulez (and most others - Herrmann!) carried themselves, back when society in general was much politer on the surface at least. Maybe it was part of the magic, and the concept of freedom which is rapidly being curtailed...

All this does not mean I am proposing that boorish, dockyard behaviour is the useful and optimal begaviour for educated people. However, when tempratures rise, I suggest we all be a little more tolerant, a little less thin-skinned, even if it involves personal, off-topic attacks (which I don't think I have personally ever employed, if memory serves). Bottom line: How much are you really offended and hurt?

Just my opinion.

If you can't notate/MIDI it yourself, it's NOT your music!

In these modern days to be vulgar, illiterate, common and vicious, seems to give a man a marvelous infinity of rights that his honest fathers never dreamed of. - Oscar Wilde
Posted on Sat, Nov 04 2017 03:16
by Guy Bacos
Joined on Sun, Jan 16 2005, Quebec, Canada, Posts 1986

The apologogy is not so much from Guy Bacos the VSL user and composer, but from Guy Bacos VSL demo maker. I'd like to be able to show the same class as Dietz, Paul and all the other moderators here, and I fell short, since I think I have a certain responsibilty, so wasn't too proud of that. 

The comments were very nice! 

And FabioA, of course I'll always keep commenting on the forum! 

PS I think Bartok would dig my music. :) 

Posted on Sat, Nov 04 2017 12:37
by mh-7635
Joined on Wed, Aug 04 2004, Posts 190

 

"ICBM's"  (Errikos)

Irritable Conversational Boxing (re) Music.

(sorry Guy...just had to....:-)

Posted on Sat, Nov 04 2017 15:09
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5512

"...Being a member myself from almost day one here - and one that has exhibited zen-like serenity while surrounded by formidable volcanic activity (and mild folly) through the years, and one who has barely raised the forum's mercury and only on occasion with some carefully chosen admonitions and timid suggestions..." - Errikos

A new height in irony has now been reached. 

Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 18:12
by jsg
Joined on Thu, Jan 19 2006, San Francisco, CA USA, Posts 287

Originally Posted by: Guy Bacos Go to Quoted Post

I'd like to apologize to the people of the forum and moderators regarding the couple of threads with the heated exchanges. Noone requested I apologize or said anything about it, I just want to let people know that this should not be a reflection of me, and I think people knows this, and although I firmly maintain my opinions, I should of quit after the point was made before the discussion got out of hand.

VSL has a classy forum and I'd like to be respectful to how it should be, also as a VSL demo maker.

Thanks,

Guy

Why are you apologizing, you didn't even post once to this thread?  Is it because you are the forum moderator? 

Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 18:40
by Guy Bacos
Joined on Sun, Jan 16 2005, Quebec, Canada, Posts 1986

Originally Posted by: jsg Go to Quoted Post

 

Why are you apologizing, you didn't even post once to this thread?  Is it because you are the forum moderator? 

 

I'm not a mod here.

Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 20:19
by jsg
Joined on Thu, Jan 19 2006, San Francisco, CA USA, Posts 287
Originally Posted by: Guy Bacos Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: jsg Go to Quoted Post


Why are you apologizing, you didn't even post once to this thread? Is it because you are the forum moderator?


I'm not a mod here.


Guy,

I have no idea why you feel an apology is applicable. If you were the moderator it might make sense as the discussion degenerated into childish one-upsmanship. But you didn't participate!
Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 20:34
by Guy Bacos
Joined on Sun, Jan 16 2005, Quebec, Canada, Posts 1986

Originally Posted by: jsg Go to Quoted Post
Guy, I have no idea why you feel an apology is applicable. If you were the moderator it might make sense as the discussion degenerated into childish one-upsmanship. But you didn't participate!

Actually I was tangled in a couple of threads involving heated exchanges with fahl5, However, I should mention, I never resoted to personal attacks or cheap shots, so that's not the issue, but it did degenerate into a bit of a brawl, and I absolutely meant every word I said with no regrets, but as a VSL demo maker, sometimes I have to make sure I keep my tie on in a public forum. :) 

I fear this thread is making it a bigger deal than it is, and perhaps I didn't need to apologize.

I'll have to take the "Learn When to Apologize 101" class.

Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 20:41
by jsg
Joined on Thu, Jan 19 2006, San Francisco, CA USA, Posts 287

Originally Posted by: Guy Bacos Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: jsg Go to Quoted Post
Guy, I have no idea why you feel an apology is applicable. If you were the moderator it might make sense as the discussion degenerated into childish one-upsmanship. But you didn't participate!

Actually I was tangled in a couple of threads involving heated exchanges with fahl5, However, I should mention, I never resoted to personal attacks or cheap shots, so that's not the issue, but it did degenerate into a bit of a brawl, and as a VSL demo maker, didn't thought it was a good image.

I fear this thread is making it a bigger deal than it is, and perhaps I didn't need to apologize.

I'll have to take the "Learn When to Apologize 101" class.

Well, I suppose it's better to apologize when not necessary than not to apologize when one should. 

Posted on Sun, Nov 05 2017 22:18
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5512

.

Posted on Tue, Nov 07 2017 11:02
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Göttingen, Posts 953

Originally Posted by: agitato Go to Quoted Post

Fahl, 

Maybe there is some issue with your communicating in English, but your response to Guy sounded rude and uncalled for. Guy wasnt lecturing you or anyone, but apologizing to all of us (for no valid reason). But in your response you seem to give him advice on how to behave ('learn to respect?'). Thats the way it comes across.

If you want to know what "rude" is you will most likely find nore than acceptabnle Examples in Postings by William.

There is exactly nothing rude nor even personal abusive or what ever, when I consent Guy and express the very justifed whish that he would respect in future the fact that he might get an answer on what he is posting.

This was the only but obviously severe problem of our communication, that as soon I just answered wih well founded arguments. Guy was not able to refer to the arguments anymore but tried to debase my person and alleged character. And this is the point where I still whish he would have enough respect for other members to be ready to stay on the level of an objective music-related discussion and do not descent into debasing personal wordings. against the person who he talks to, because becoming personal in that way does mean loosing any substance of a constructive music related discussion.

Even if Guy Bacos explicitly tried to justify rude personal and completly inacceptable aggression like those of William  against me. I still hope that Guy Bacos will never sink on such a low niveau.

Therefore I cannot see anyhing more helpful, than to express my hope that we all come back to a music related discussion, with all respect for those we talk to and what ever musical opinion or arguments they would like to share.

Sorry but only where anyone looses that respect or even begins to use debasing or even aggressive wordings (like William nore often than acceptabl does), I think it must be in interest of a good discussion to remind that a music related discussion would take very much profit from the personal respect between each other even if he answers something perhaps not expected (as far it is music relted and not personal).

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3648 mp3 with a whole Week (=7 Days /=171 hours) of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de
a) ...Synchron-Strings explored in 40 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Strings.

b) ...Synchron-Steinway explored in 48 mp3 with nearly three hours of complete and ambitious scores from 18th 19th 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Steinway.
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