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Posted on Tue, Mar 06 2018 18:36
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26

Hi Everyone,

now that SyS is almost complete, I tried to make a comparison between Orchestral Strings, Dimension Strings and Synchron Strings.
I used a short part of a piece that I wrote sometimes ago, using only the strings part, no woodwinds or brass and so on.
For every instruments I used breath controller and mostly legato patches, here and there portato.
For SyS I used Leg-Soft-LyV Full Velocities Room-Mix and a little bit of Miracle; for Orch. Str. and Dim. Str. I used Mir Pro and Teldex as venue (2nd Vlns on the right).
There is no EQ or Comp at all, just the original sound.
The sequence in the file audio is:
1- Orch. Str.
2- Dim. Str.
3- SyS
4- Orch. and Dim. together
I didn't tweak the midi files so much, it is mostly on the fly, I added some articulations after the recording and corrected some errors, that's it.
I really would like to know what you think about the sound of these libraries.

EDIT

I have added a file of the same music using Appassionata Strings.

That's a new library for me so this is only a starting point, but I had a great first impression.

Again, MIR Pro with the Teldex venue.

The volume is higher than the other file and in the first 5 seconds there is silence.

Happy listening and thanks for sharing here your impressions!

File Attachment(s):
ProvaU0020OrchU0020Str-DimU0020Strings-Synchron.mp3 (5,628kb) downloaded 553 time(s).
ProvaU0020AppassionataU0020Strings.mp3 (1,251kb) downloaded 90 time(s).

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Posted on Wed, Mar 07 2018 14:12
by Xander S.
Joined on Sat, Nov 27 2004, Vienna, Posts 78

First of all, let me tell you that I think your string writing is beautiful and THANKS for the comparison!

Your post is just in time. I've done a lot of composing with VSL and it's only when I have strings-only parts that I'm dissatisfied with the results. I use a lot of modwheel, probably the equivalent of what you do with the breath-controller, and also a mix of legato and non-legato patches from the VI special editions - most of the time doubling those two.

The problem is that no matter what I do, the string section doesn't come across full-bodied and homogenous. I think the sound that you have in your dimension strings demo is closest to what I'd want it to sound like. As to the synchron strings, I haven't heard anything yet that - for my taste - provides the natural flow and vibe which I think is essential to strings.

In the end I'm kind of frustrated by the amount of time I have to invest into the string parts to make them sound acceptable. I've considered turning to different sample libraries, but I'm still hesitating because VSL samples have always been more than sublime. My feeling, however, is that I'm going to stray very soon.

Web: www.xanderscores.com
DAW: Dell XPS One, Win 8.1, Cubase 7.5, VE Pro, VI Sp.Ed.Compl. Vienna Suite
Posted on Wed, Mar 07 2018 19:31
by Crystal
Joined on Thu, Feb 27 2003, Frogs eater country., Posts 136

Very good test, Nicola, congrats.

 

My vote goes to Dimension Strings. They sound so… alive.

In term of realism, it becomes hard to say : “this is fake”, which is a challenge with strings.

 

When you say “Orch. and Dim. together”, you mean you mixed them ?

 

 

 

Gabriel Plalame

The French dyslexic who speaks badly English.
Posted on Wed, Mar 07 2018 22:50
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26

Hi Xander,

happy that you like the music.

I have libraries from other companies too, like Orchestral Tools or Spitfire, but I have to say that at the end I use mostly VSL.

I think Dim. Strings was the first library I bought from VSL and Orch. Strings one of the last (today I bought the Harp 1 and it is great).

Also for Dim Brass and Woodwinds I have always loved the sound, but it was difficult for me to obtain something totally satisfying. But I wanted to use them because, as you said, the sound is more than sublime :-)

MIR Pro and the breath controller helped me a lot in this, expecially the last one.

In this last period I played a lot with them and I started to understand how to use them in a way that I like and now I really appreciate these libraries. My template is almost exclusively VSL for the orchestra now.

For me it is very important to create my own presets of the instruments, trying to understand which articulations I will use and which one I don't mind. I change the presets until I am totally confortable with them.

I think you should try something else, I use cinematic Strings 2 and I am happy with it, but obviously everyone has got his own preferencies ;-)

All the best,

Nicola

Posted on Wed, Mar 07 2018 23:00
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26

Hi Gabriel,

I agree with you, Dim. Strings are great, I recorded separately every instrument, but I am sure that I could obtain even more from them with more diligence.

In "Orch. and Dim. together" I simply putted the two version together ;-) I didn't make it with Synchron because my 2nd vlns of Orch. string and Dim. strings are on the right (I don't like the transposition trick, never used it).

All the best,

Nicola

Posted on Thu, Mar 08 2018 14:31
by Paul McGraw
Joined on Mon, Feb 29 2016, Georgia, USA, Posts 361

Originally Posted by: nicola74 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Everyone,

now that SyS is almost complete, I tried to make a comparison between Orchestral Strings, Dimension Strings and Synchron Strings.
I used a short part of a piece that I wrote sometimes ago, using only the strings part, no woodwinds or brass and so on.
For every instruments I used breath controller and mostly legato patches, here and there portato.
For SyS I used Leg-Soft-LyV Full Velocities Room-Mix and a little bit of Miracle; for Orch. Str. and Dim. Str. I used Mir Pro and Teldex as venue (2nd Vlns on the right).
There is no EQ or Comp at all, just the original sound.
The sequence in the file audio is:
1- Orch. Str.
2- Dim. Str.
3- SyS
4- Orch. and Dim. together
I didn't tweak the midi files so much, it is mostly on the fly, I added some articulations after the recording and corrected some errors, that's it.
I really would like to know what you think about the sound of these libraries.

Thanks for posting this awesome demonstration. The string writing is great as previously said.

The most remarkable thing to me is how similar they all sound. Especially since you did nothing with EQ or compression. Also remarkable since you used Teldex for Orch. Strings and Dim. Strings, yet the room sounds match very closely. I am amazed that there is not more difference in room sound.

Since I hear more similarities than differences, I could not possibly pick a favorite.

Posted on Sat, Mar 10 2018 10:29
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: Paul McGraw Go to Quoted Post
Originally Posted by: nicola74 Go to Quoted Post
Hi Everyone,now that SyS is almost complete, I tried to make a comparison between Orchestral Strings, Dimension Strings and Synchron Strings.I used a short part of a piece that I wrote sometimes ago, using only the strings part, no woodwinds or brass and so on.For every instruments I used breath controller and mostly legato patches, here and there portato.For SyS I used Leg-Soft-LyV Full Velocities Room-Mix and a little bit of Miracle; for Orch. Str. and Dim. Str. I used Mir Pro and Teldex as venue (2nd Vlns on the right).There is no EQ or Comp at all, just the original sound.The sequence in the file audio is:1- Orch. Str.2- Dim. Str.3- SyS4- Orch. and Dim. togetherI didn't tweak the midi files so much, it is mostly on the fly, I added some articulations after the recording and corrected some errors, that's it. I really would like to know what you think about the sound of these libraries.

Thanks for posting this awesome demonstration. The string writing is great as previously said.
The most remarkable thing to me is how similar they all sound. Especially since you did nothing with EQ or compression. Also remarkable since you used Teldex for Orch. Strings and Dim. Strings, yet the room sounds match very closely. I am amazed that there is not more difference in room sound.
Since I hear more similarities than differences, I could not possibly pick a favorite.


HI Paul,
I agree with you, Synchron stage and Teldex match very well :-)
But I think that the sound is different between the three libraries, not one better than the other, but they have different sound for different scopes.
Obviously this is my personal taste, everyone is welcome ;-)
Posted on Sat, Mar 10 2018 12:32
by FabioA
Joined on Fri, Jan 13 2012, Posts 84

great writing, great test!

I loved especially the Orchestral Strings version!

The Synchron version is the only one that doesn't convince me 100%. There are some bumps in the dynamic here and there, while the other libraries sound so smooth and natural.

Posted on Sat, Mar 10 2018 18:49
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: FabioA Go to Quoted Post
great writing, great test!I loved especially the Orchestral Strings version!The Synchron version is the only one that doesn't convince me 100%. There are some bumps in the dynamic here and there, while the other libraries sound so smooth and natural.


HI Fabio,
I am sure that it is possible to make more realistic lines with Synchron, without bumps and so on, but I have to say that for me it was easier to record midi with Orch. Strings and Dim. Strings...
Posted on Sat, Mar 10 2018 19:46
by stephen limbaugh
Joined on Tue, Feb 23 2016, Los Angeles, Posts 163

Re Teledex,

At the Westlake Pro demonstration, VSL Paul when asked about other MIRPro roompacks and Synchron mentioned that Teledex was a room that matched pretty well.

Posted on Sun, Mar 11 2018 19:54
by jcandela
Joined on Tue, Jan 15 2013, Madrid, Posts 11
Thanks Nicola. After listen to your great composition (congratulations) I've decided to buy Dim Strings. José Candela Castillo, Madrid. https://www.youtube.com/...UC94qinFTAc4OSfq6--SGvXw
Posted on Sun, Mar 11 2018 21:20
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: jcandela Go to Quoted Post
Thanks Nicola. After listen to your great composition (congratulations) I've decided to buy Dim Strings. José Candela Castillo, Madrid. https://www.youtube.com/...UC94qinFTAc4OSfq6--SGvXw


HI José,
Happy that you like my music, thanks a lot.
Maybe Dim Strings is not the best library for epic music, but I think is the best for almost everything else, even if now I am thinking about Appassionata strings ;-)
Obviously personal preference...
All the best,
Nicola
Posted on Mon, Mar 12 2018 11:40
by Xander S.
Joined on Sat, Nov 27 2004, Vienna, Posts 78

I haven't gone through all the posts, so please forgive me if I'm asking something obvious, but why do Dimension Strings cost so much more than, say, Appassionata strings?

Web: www.xanderscores.com
DAW: Dell XPS One, Win 8.1, Cubase 7.5, VE Pro, VI Sp.Ed.Compl. Vienna Suite
Posted on Mon, Mar 12 2018 18:46
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: Xander S. Go to Quoted Post
<p>I haven't gone through all the posts, so please forgive me if I'm asking something obvious, but why do Dimension Strings cost so much more than, say, Appassionata strings?</p>


HI Xander,
I don't know exactly, probably you should ask to Paul Kopf ;-)
But I think that they did a enormous work editing 24 single instruments instead 5 strings section and I have to say that, for me, the result is amazing :-)
Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 02:49
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5194

The best one of this performance is Dimension Strings.  

The Synchron have too much high frequency, a common problem in sampled strings.  

Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 08:09
by antcarrier
Joined on Fri, Sep 24 2010, Sunshine Coast, Australia, Posts 40
Dimension Strings FTW!
I have SyS & Dimension. In my experience, DS + MIR is the king, easily. If only it had more velocity layers like SyS - it would be mind blowing!
https://soundcloud.com/jonny_lawson/
Dimension Strings 1+2, Harps, Vienna Imperial
Winds Complete, Percussion Complete, MIR Pro, VI Pro
Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 15:28
by theiss1979
Joined on Mon, Jan 27 2003, Hessen, Germany, Posts 134

Wow, thank you very much for this great comparison. Too bad there is no snippet for Appasionata Strings.

Judging from those snippets, in my opinion Dimension Strings are still the holy grail and pinnacle of all the VSL string libraries, yet combining them with Orchestral Strings really adds alot to them which is astounishing.

It is also quite interesting to see how well those old Orchestral Strings aged and still boldly stand against all the newer libraries, including SyS.

Sebastian
Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 17:13
by Kai
Joined on Sun, Dec 29 2002, Graz, Austria, Posts 127

Nicola, this is a great midi rendition and an extremely useful comparison - thanks so much for sharing!

Dimension+Orchestral is my favorite version as well. However if I had to choose any single library it would actually be Orchestral, since they have this silky texture in the high strings (around 0.25), that is just amazing.

Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 18:39
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: antcarrier Go to Quoted Post
Dimension Strings FTW!
I have SyS & Dimension. In my experience, DS + MIR is the king, easily. If only it had more velocity layers like SyS - it would be mind blowing!


I would like to try DS with more layer, but just for curiosity, because I don't miss, say, 8 layers, the transition and the dynamic are already great. I suppose, but I have to say that I don't know anything about programming, that to record 8 velocity layer the string players have to play in a very "static" way to not change too much the dynamic of the note and the natural inner musicality could suffer a little bit because of this. Again, this idea probably is the most stupid idea of the last ten years and maybe I will understand it by myself, but I would like to know if it is completely wrong. I really love the Synchron strings' sound and surely I have to improve my ability with this new library, but for now it is the most difficult to use for me.
Anyway until now only with VSL libraries I have the feeling that the pp is not a mf with lowered volume and for sure Synchron is not an ecception in this case ;-)
Posted on Tue, Mar 13 2018 18:44
by nicola74
Joined on Sun, Aug 02 2009, Posts 26
Originally Posted by: theiss1979 Go to Quoted Post
<p>Wow, thank you very much for this great comparison. Too bad there is no snippet for Appasionata Strings.</p>
<p>Judging from those snippets, in my opinion Dimension Strings are still the holy grail and pinnacle of all the VSL string libraries, yet combining them with Orchestral Strings really adds alot&nbsp;to them which is astounishing.</p>
<p>It is also quite interesting to see how well those old Orchestral Strings aged and still boldly stand against all the newer libraries, including SyS.</p>


I won't have Appassionata Strings, at least for now ;-)
I agree with you, layering DS and Orch Strings the result is super!
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