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Posted on Sun, Jun 24 2018 20:46
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Hi,

It would be very helpful if VSL posts new Synchron Strings 1 Audio Demos, produced using the new Synchron Strings 1 Player. 

So..  Can we expect to have some great sounding new audio demos of Synchron Strings posted soon ? 

Thanks,

Muziksculp 

Posted on Mon, Jun 25 2018 23:14
by Pixelpoet1985
Joined on Fri, Dec 23 2016, Germany, Posts 225

I really would like to know if one can realise some "Hollywood" sounding music, with expressive legato lines which sound realistic. Or something like in the Blue Planet promo video.

Because I can't and I don't think that anyone else can. Harsh words, I know. I just want to be persuaded.

Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 09:09
by Sovereign
Joined on Sun, Nov 05 2017, Posts 19
Originally Posted by: Pixelpoet1985 Go to Quoted Post
I really would like to know if onecan realise some "Hollywood" sounding music, with expressive legato lines which sound realistic. Or something like in the Blue Planet promo video.Because I can't and I don't thinkthat anyone else can. Harsh words, I know. I just want to be persuaded.
Harsh words, but true. I spent some hours yesterday with synchron, even though I planned on wiping it from ssd, trying to get it to do a John Williams piece I mocked up months ago. It's just not possible, the mix doesn't help and the legato works against you. Sigh.
Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 15:55
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Hi,

Can someone at VSL tell us if they will be posting new audio demos of Synchron Strings 1,  produced using the Synchron Strings Player ?  

i.e. ... A healthy variety of new audio demos, showcasing various styles, such as Up & DownTempo Soundtrack style,  and some Classical and possibly Baroque flavored tracks. 

Your feedback on this would be appreciated. 

Thanks,

Muziksculp  

Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 17:48
by Beat Kaufmann
Joined on Fri, Jan 03 2003, Switzerland/Brugg, Posts 1726

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post

Demo from  film to possibly Baroque flavored tracks.

Muziksculp  

Hello Muzikculp
You have had so many good posts here. I always liked to read them. But your demand for demos from film music to baroque music with the "Synchron Strings" is absurd. With the Dimension Strings you can not do this balancing act either. At the moment I notice in every letter, in every line and in every post of you that you have made it your goal to "finish" this new library. I think it is fair to say that you do not like a product because of this an that - no problem. And yes I have read that a lot now. So, meanwhile, your message should be clear to everyone. Why always more and more of them?

In your case I would try to contact VSL and ask if there is any way to sell (give back) the license. Maybe you'll find another solution together that will make you feel OK again.
I am sure that you will experience VSL as fair as we are used to. In addition, this way extends your life. Hatred unfortunately shortens it.

Incidentally, the idea of "user/VSL demos" is a good one. Unfortunately I will not find the time until mid-July to deliver one or two demos myself.

All the best

Beat

www.musik-produktion-createc.ch (Konzertaufnahmen, Musik mit Samples)
at www.beat-kaufmann.com : MIXING an ORCHESTRA - TUTORIAL
Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 18:16
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Originally Posted by: Beat Kaufmann Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post

Demo from  film to possibly Baroque flavored tracks.

Muziksculp  

Hello Muzikculp
You have had so many good posts here. I always liked to read them. But your demand for demos from film music to baroque music with the "Synchron Strings" is absurd. With the Dimension Strings you can not do this balancing act either. At the moment I notice in every letter, in every line and in every post of you that you have made it your goal to "finish" this new library. I think it is fair to say that you do not like a product because of this an that - no problem. And yes I have read that a lot now. So, meanwhile, your message should be clear to everyone. Why always more and more of them?

In your case I would try to contact VSL and ask if there is any way to sell (give back) the license. Maybe you'll find another solution together that will make you feel OK again.
I am sure that you will experience VSL as fair as we are used to. In addition, this way extends your life. Hatred unfortunately shortens it.

Incidentally, the idea of "user/VSL demos" is a good one. Unfortunately I will not find the time until mid-July to deliver one or two demos myself.

All the best

Beat

Hi Beat,

I think I'm just asking for something very reasonable, and logical from VSL. Now that the new Synchron Player for Synchron Strings 1 is ready, and the library itself is completed. Audio Demos would be the ultimate proof to many of us who are in doubt about this library's capabilities, quality, and flexibility. 

With regards to asking for a variety of audio demos styles, including some baroque style demo/s, well.. I see no reason why this won't be possible, given the many dynamics it offers for the short articulations. I don't know why that wouldn't be possible to realise using Synchron Strings 1.  

With regards to my opinion about this library, well.. I'm just judging it by what I hear from current owners, who seem to be unsatisfied with it. I have not expressed my interest in selling, or getting a refund for it, I'm trying to stay as neutral as possible, and I have no hatred towards it, Just a bit of uncomfort with the way this library was released, and the time it took for it to be completed, the negative aura, and publicity that surrounds it, and now the lack of audio demos to showcase it when used with the new Synchron Player. 

I purchased the full version of Synchron Strings when it was first announced last year, so I'm usually very confident, and trust VSL products, and a fan of many of their previous libraries. That's why I didn't hesitate to Pre-Order it last year. 

I have decided to not bother installing Synchron Strings 1 (Full Version) on my PC, until I hear some new audio demos posted by VSL. that will prove to me that this library is worth installing on my SSD, so far this has not happened. Maybe they need more time to make these new demos. So I will just wait, and hope that the demos will be impressive sounding, and will prove that Synchron Strings 1 is an amazing, and very realistic sounding library. 

Hopefully this will happen in the very near future. 

Cheers,

Muziksculp 

Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 22:13
by JimmyHellfire
Joined on Tue, Dec 24 2013, Posts 333

Hey muziksculp. Here's a suggestion: how about installing only the close and mid mics and the room mix? The installation process makes this possible. That way, you would cut down the total disk space requirements by quite a bit and would still have a pretty good idea of what the library can and can't do. With the standard library, not installing the main + main center mics (why are these separate anyway?) would save you around 94 GB.

The Synchron Player comes with some mixer presets for all sections - close, classical, wide, distant, ambient. The mixes are done very well, are good starting points and should cover the most needed sonic characteristics. The cool thing about these is that if you're going with the room mix versions of the presets, only the room mix, the mid and in some cases the close mics are required. The room mix is kind of the bulk of the sound and you dial in mids (and if needed the close) to taste for more or less close and direct sound.

I spent some time comparing the room mix versions of the presets with their decca multi-mic counterparts and honestly, I think they hold up very well and I don't hear any noteworthy differences between them. The room mix versions sound a bit "roomier" and more airy due to the fact that the mics from the full library have been baked into the downmix as well, but that's not a bad thing either, right?

I think that room mix + mid + close could quite possibly be sufficient for many users. I'm thinking of going this route for the time being and yanking the excess mics from the drive, because I too can't justify having such a big library taking up all this space - not considering the limited number of actually good sounding articulations available.  But there are some things about the library that I really like - the overall sound and clarity, the dynamic shorts, the beautiful and musical soft longs, the pizz - and that's not a bad thing to have in the toolbox.

So I suggest installing only the three previously mentioned mic positions, making some music and getting some actual first-hand experience with the library and the player, instead of relying solely on other people's opinions. Maybe you'll find things about the library that you like. That's exactly why many of us are so adamant in pointing out the flaws and shortcomings - because there's a lot to like and with some revisions and additions, the library could still live up to the usual high VSL standards and be absolutely killer.

On a sidenote, the existence of these presets already show that SyS was of course not conceived as a library that's tailored to just one specific sound, and the objection that you're expecting something from it that it can't possibly deliver is of course mistaken.

Posted on Tue, Jun 26 2018 22:36
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Originally Posted by: JimmyHellfire Go to Quoted Post

Hey muziksculp. Here's a suggestion: how about installing only the close and mid mics and the room mix? The installation process makes this possible. That way, you would cut down the total disk space requirements by quite a bit and would still have a pretty good idea of what the library can and can't do. With the standard library, not installing the main + main center mics (why are these separate anyway?) would save you around 94 GB.

Hi JimmyHellfire,

Thanks for the suggestion to install just the close, mid and room mix mics, to conserve SSD space, and to give the library a spin. I might just do that. I can install some of the other mic options the full version offers if I feel it's worth it. 

Q1. How many GB do the (Close, Mid, and Room Mix) mics consume, and did you install the entire Full version (if you have it) to test all mic options, If Yes, are they worth the SSD space ?  

Q2. How do you like the Legatos, and Sustains it offers via Synchron Player ?  

I still hope that VSL will post some well produced audio demos of Synchron Strings 1, produced using the Synchron Player in the near future. 

Cheers,

Muziksculp 

Posted on Wed, Jun 27 2018 23:19
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Göttingen, Posts 953

Ok here you can find my first result with Syncbhron-Player-Strings and there are some other to come the mnext days. I hope you like it.

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3648 mp3 with a whole Week (=7 Days /=171 hours) of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de
a) ...Synchron-Strings explored in 40 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Strings.

b) ...Synchron-Steinway explored in 48 mp3 with nearly three hours of complete and ambitious scores from 18th 19th 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Steinway.
Posted on Sun, Jul 01 2018 17:58
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

I wonder why VSL has not posted any new Synchron Strings 1 Audio Demos, produced using the new Synchron Strings 1 Player ?  

Can anyone at VSL give us some feedback if we can expect to see some new Synchron Strings 1 audio demos posted in the near future ? 

Thanks, 

Posted on Thu, Jul 05 2018 18:44
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Hi VSL/Paul,

Can you please let us know if you will be posting new Synchron Strings 1 Audio Demos, produced using the new Synchron Strings 1 Player soon ? 

Thanks,

Muziksculp 

Posted on Wed, Jul 25 2018 18:29
by agitato
Joined on Mon, Jun 22 2015, Posts 385

Originally Posted by: Pixelpoet1985 Go to Quoted Post

I really would like to know if one can realise some "Hollywood" sounding music, with expressive legato lines which sound realistic. Or something like in the Blue Planet promo video.

Because I can't and I don't think that anyone else can. Harsh words, I know. I just want to be persuaded.

Hi Pixelpoet, 

some suggestions from a novice....

I am wondering whats so special about "Hollwood sounding" music. Firstly, we know that all orchestral hollywood music has its roots in late romantic classical music. So it might be better to listen to and try imitating romantic masterworks since they are the source of all orchestral HW music.

Secondly, no library by itself will automatically help you get the sound you hear in, say, John WIlliams or Bernard Hermann. It takes years and years of training and musicianship, and on top of that a thorough knowledge of the sample library.  This is serious business. If you want to sound like John WIlliams, you need to undergo the training....he as a Juliard trained Jazz and classical pianist, and lived and breathed around orchstras since he was a child. So just think abotu how much effort it takes. To think that we can shell out a few grand on a sample library and get that effect....not gonna happen. As Errikos (I think) once described...imagine that you have an orchestra in the next hall waiting for you. What are you going to do with them? The power is limitless, but you need to know how to use them efficiently before they even make a sound.

The quality of renditions of VSL truly depend on both the level of musicianship and programming skills of the person using it. Hypothetically...if Williams or Mozart had these libraries and knew the programming skills, they would produce fantastic music. Most of the demos here attest to the power of VSL...doesnt matter if its Synchron or the Cube or whatever.

Sorry if this sounds insulting...not my intention and I am not assuming you are an amateur. This is just a reflection of what I am myself learning and experiencing as I navigate the challenge of becoming a composer.

Best

Anand

P.S. btw this is one of the best Star wars renditions with VSL Ive heard. You can hear the one on the VSL demo page as well. You cant find problems with the legato here.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuSpC4Y9tq0

Anand Kumar
Posted on Wed, Jul 25 2018 20:24
by Pixelpoet1985
Joined on Fri, Dec 23 2016, Germany, Posts 225

Originally Posted by: agitato Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: Pixelpoet1985 Go to Quoted Post

I really would like to know if one can realise some "Hollywood" sounding music, with expressive legato lines which sound realistic. Or something like in the Blue Planet promo video.

Because I can't and I don't think that anyone else can. Harsh words, I know. I just want to be persuaded.

Hi Pixelpoet, 

some suggestions from a novice....

I am wondering whats so special about "Hollwood sounding" music. Firstly, we know that all orchestral hollywood music has its roots in late romantic classical music. So it might be better to listen to and try imitating romantic masterworks since they are the source of all orchestral HW music.

Secondly, no library by itself will automatically help you get the sound you hear in, say, John WIlliams or Bernard Hermann. It takes years and years of training and musicianship, and on top of that a thorough knowledge of the sample library.  This is serious business. If you want to sound like John WIlliams, you need to undergo the training....he as a Juliard trained Jazz and classical pianist, and lived and breathed around orchstras since he was a child. So just think abotu how much effort it takes. To think that we can shell out a few grand on a sample library and get that effect....not gonna happen. As Errikos (I think) once described...imagine that you have an orchestra in the next hall waiting for you. What are you going to do with them? The power is limitless, but you need to know how to use them efficiently before they even make a sound.

The quality of renditions of VSL truly depend on both the level of musicianship and programming skills of the person using it. Hypothetically...if Williams or Mozart had these libraries and knew the programming skills, they would produce fantastic music. Most of the demos here attest to the power of VSL...doesnt matter if its Synchron or the Cube or whatever.

Sorry if this sounds insulting...not my intention and I am not assuming you are an amateur. This is just a reflection of what I am myself learning and experiencing as I navigate the challenge of becoming a composer.

Best

Anand

P.S. btw this is one of the best Star wars renditions with VSL Ive heard. You can hear the one on the VSL demo page as well. You cant find problems with the legato here.  

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuSpC4Y9tq0

 

Now, everyone is talking about me, but actually there are so many people who don't like Synchron Strings. It's just my opinion, I am also a beginner. But I have ears and I have a sonic taste/preference.

I know what you are talking about that orchestration is indeed the key to this "Hollywood" sound, but for this you need THE appropriate tool. I'm repeating myself: I also have LASS, and for me it's the best playable and realistic library. I also have the older VSL strings and they sound way better in terms of the legatos. Synchron Strings, for me, isn't just the appropriate tool. With LASS I can achieve classical, romantic or hollywood music, because it comes really close to the real thing. And this is the prerequisite. And when John Williams is composing on his piano (with the orchestration in mind) he can RELY on the real thing. If you can't rely on it than you can be an orchestration god, and it won't work. That's my point.

I know the Star Wars demo you posted quite well. It's an old one, and this was the reason I started with the Special Editions. I like it, it does sound realistic, but not Synchron Strings, and we're talking about the latter.

Please stop making me the bad boy, there are many with the same opinions as mine, and when you are comfortable with Synchron Strings than it's okay. 

Posted on Wed, Jul 25 2018 20:30
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Going back to the main topic of this thread.

Unfortunately VSL has not posted any new Audio Demos of VSL Synchron Strings I, using the new Synchron Player. I have requested this a while ago, but so far VSL has not delivered, and Paul of VSL has ignored my requests, and not even bothered replying on this thread. 

I would be delighted if they posted some new Cinematic Demos, not re-creations of classical works. using Synchron Strings I , running in the new Synchron Player. 

Posted on Wed, Jul 25 2018 20:48
by agitato
Joined on Mon, Jun 22 2015, Posts 385

Sorry, i didnt mean to make you the bad boy at all.....my point was that many people have done amazing things with VSL strings which I aspire too...so I have a long way to go before I need another library. I am not sure why you are not satisfied with the legato in the VI strings, which is the best I've heard.

LASS does sound very good btw, added to on my wishlist.

Anand

Anand Kumar
Posted on Thu, Jul 26 2018 11:36
by Dominique
Joined on Fri, Aug 08 2008, Posts 178

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post
Unfortunately VSL has not posted any new Audio Demos of VSL Synchron Strings I, using the new Synchron Player.

The reason seems to be pretty obvious: it is not necessary because the new player doesn't sound different than the 'old' one. It's a different workflow, not a different sound. If it would sound vastly different, then VSL certainly would have advertised it and posted demos. Also, if you really wanted a response to your questions why not just send an e-mail to support? In my experience they are friendly, quick, and happy to answer any questions.

Posted on Thu, Jul 26 2018 14:46
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Göttingen, Posts 953

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post

I would be delighted if they posted some new Cinematic Demos, not re-creations of classical works. using Synchron Strings I , running in the new Synchron Player. 

There is not a single "re-creations of classical works" among the Synchron Strings I 'demos' at all (as far as I know its all Guy Bacos selfmade Stuff)

And I honestly haven't heard yet at all any "classical" (1770-1827) Work "re-created" with Synchron Strings anywhere.

But seriously: if you dont own SyStr yet perhaps you should just wait for what others do. I am sure there will be frequently new User-Recordings with Synchron-Strings posted here made by more and more different users with different musical intentions. The most who own it already just began to become familiar with it. I am sure during next year you will be able to get a much better impression, what real-world-user realy can achieve with that librariy. So no one would need anymore discuss just "opinions".

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3648 mp3 with a whole Week (=7 Days /=171 hours) of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de
a) ...Synchron-Strings explored in 40 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Strings.

b) ...Synchron-Steinway explored in 48 mp3 with nearly three hours of complete and ambitious scores from 18th 19th 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Steinway.
Posted on Thu, Jul 26 2018 14:48
by muziksculp
Joined on Fri, Oct 03 2003, U.S.A., Posts 404

Originally Posted by: Dominique Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post
Unfortunately VSL has not posted any new Audio Demos of VSL Synchron Strings I, using the new Synchron Player.

The reason seems to be pretty obvious: it is not necessary because the new player doesn't sound different than the 'old' one. It's a different workflow, not a different sound. If it would sound vastly different, then VSL certainly would have advertised it and posted demos. Also, if you really wanted a response to your questions why not just send an e-mail to support? In my experience they are friendly, quick, and happy to answer any questions.

I think more demos of VSL Synchron Strings I would be a good thing, especially now that Synchron Strings I has the new Player, (even if it doesn't sound different when using the new Player).  

Posted on Thu, Jul 26 2018 15:12
by Pixelpoet1985
Joined on Fri, Dec 23 2016, Germany, Posts 225

Originally Posted by: agitato Go to Quoted Post

Sorry, i didnt mean to make you the bad boy at all.....my point was that many people have done amazing things with VSL strings which I aspire too...so I have a long way to go before I need another library. I am not sure why you are not satisfied with the legato in the VI strings, which is the best I've heard.

LASS does sound very good btw, added to on my wishlist.

Anand

I didn't want to be rude, sorry. I didn't mean it that way. But in the last time everyone was quoting my statement from the other thread... :)

I started with the Special Editions, and then upgraded to Chamber, Orchestral and Appassionata Strings standard editions. They have better legatos than Synchron Strings, I do like these. But finally I decided to stay with LASS. It's the best tool for me. 

Sascha

Posted on Thu, Jul 26 2018 15:23
by Pixelpoet1985
Joined on Fri, Dec 23 2016, Germany, Posts 225

Originally Posted by: Dominique Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: muziksculp Go to Quoted Post
Unfortunately VSL has not posted any new Audio Demos of VSL Synchron Strings I, using the new Synchron Player.

The reason seems to be pretty obvious: it is not necessary because the new player doesn't sound different than the 'old' one. It's a different workflow, not a different sound. If it would sound vastly different, then VSL certainly would have advertised it and posted demos. Also, if you really wanted a response to your questions why not just send an e-mail to support? In my experience they are friendly, quick, and happy to answer any questions.

For me there is no sonic difference between the two players, too, just the workflow.

I still want to hear a "hollywood" demo. I really liked the legato demo by @fahl5, but it doesn't come close to the real thing, in my opinion. The (majority of) demos posted are all compositions made for the capabilites of Synchron Strings, i. e. for the things it can handle well and neglecting those which it can't do. 

The older VSL string libraries have demos of Star Wars and other famous cues. I want to hear these. Why isn't there such a demo? Because Synchron Strings can't do it? I'm just wondering ...

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