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Intel or AMD with VSL
Last post Thu, Feb 20 2020 by crusoe, 18 replies.
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Posted on Fri, Sep 06 2019 16:40
by Pyre
Joined on Thu, Jun 28 2012, Posts 143

Hi everyone,

My PC is finally giving up on me, so I'll be getting a new CPU/motherboard/RAM combination, and maybe a new GPU while I'm at it. It's lasted 11 years, I think that's good going.

I remember it used to be the case that VSL users were advised towards Intel CPUs rather than AMD ones, as Intel ones ran VSL products better. Is that still the case please? I was stuck with an AMD one before, but might switch to Intel this time around if VSL stuff will work better.

I'm currently looking at this Intel chip:

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/WtyV3C/intel-core-i7-9700k-36ghz-8-core-processor-bx80684i79700kOr this AMD one (which can hyperthread, where the Intel one can't, so would probably be better):

https://pcpartpicker.com/product/QKJtt6/amd-ryzen-7-3700x-36-ghz-8-core-processor-100-100000071box

Thanks!

AMD Phenom 9850 Black Edition Quad-Core Processor (Water-Cooled)
8GB RAM
2x 1TB hard drives for libraries and audio, 1x 128GB SSD for OS
Presonus Firestudio 26-in 26-out firewire interface
Korg Triton Extreme-76 master keyboard, M-Audio MidAir-25 lap keyboard.

Windows 7 Ultimate, Cubase 4
VSL Symphonic Cube (standard library), Vienna Choir (standard library) and download instruments Recorders, Harpsichord, Basset Horn and Contrabass Clarinet.
Vienna Instruments Pro 2.4.13260 and Vienna Ensemble Pro 5.4.14074
Vienna Suite, Vienna MIR and all room packs
Sibelius 7 and Komplete 8
All 64-bit.
Posted on Thu, Dec 12 2019 05:11
by dmillionaire
Joined on Wed, Jul 21 2010, Posts 4

just read a bench test about the amd processor performance, i think i am leaning towards the amd processor

Posted on Tue, Dec 17 2019 13:33
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Hi Pyre,

Recently bought AMD Ryzen 3900X, it's been a blaze so far. Even if VSL software favors Intel for whatever reason, it's not that noticeable when all those cores just shred (I can't confirm the bias, btw, just referring to your message). My thought - worry less about the CPU and invest the money saved by staying away from overpriced Intel, into more RAM, faster SSD, etc. They are quite important for performance, too, as has been discussed a lot of times here and elsewhere.

Cheers,

Crusoe.

Posted on Tue, Dec 17 2019 21:00
by bbelius
Joined on Sat, Mar 14 2015, Posts 687
Hi Crusoe,

No bias, we simply don't have experience with the new AMD CPU architecture and too few user reports.
So we can tell that certain Intel CPUs will work. For AMD it would be nice to get more feedback from users like you that use the new Ryzen CPUs :)

Best, Ben
Ben
Technical Support - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Wed, Dec 18 2019 11:48
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Hi Ben,

That's good to know. Without any extra knowledge of the specifics, one would think that the bias could be the case indeed (with Intel compiler around, and Intel's overall dominance not so long ago in the past).

Just to add a bit of info on 3900X, all 12 cores get their share of work under a heavy load, resulting in not as much of a load on a single core, which is noticeable (Cubase and VE Pro 6). It's also worth noting that I still stay on the X370 platform, upgraded from Ryzen 1800X (which was pretty good, too, especially given its price). Works as a charm.

Cheers,

Crusoe.

Posted on Wed, Dec 18 2019 23:30
by bbelius
Joined on Sat, Mar 14 2015, Posts 687

Hi Crusoe,

Thanks for the feedback. May I ask you a favor? I am really interested in the system latency values of your workstation.
Could you download and start a tool named LatencyMon, let it run for ~5 minutes without any processing going in the background and then send me screenshots of the different results?

Feel free to mail them to and mention my name.

Thanks!

Ben

Ben
Technical Support - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Thu, Dec 19 2019 10:42
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Hi Ben,

sure, I will send them some time soon. I think I have LatencyMon installed.

Cheers,

Crusoe.

Posted on Mon, Dec 23 2019 17:43
by martin27
Joined on Mon, Jan 04 2010, Posts 38

Hi Ben and Crusoe

I am on search for new pc .

Can you post Latencymon numbers here please

Posted on Wed, Dec 25 2019 13:06
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Here's the results of LatencyMon run on my system.

Cheers,

Crusoe.

Posted on Tue, Jan 07 2020 05:06
by Austin
Joined on Thu, Oct 31 2002, California, Posts 373
Originally Posted by: crusoe Go to Quoted Post
Here's theresultsof LatencyMon run on my system.
Cheers,
Crusoe.


What is the verdict now that there is a latency number? How do the new AMD chips compare to the intel chips? Is intel still better?
Potato
Posted on Fri, Feb 14 2020 07:09
by trickytick
Joined on Fri, Feb 14 2020, Posts 6

Hi crusoe, thanks for posting about your experience using the AMD Ryzen 3900X.

I'm a tech-head and not a composer but a good friend of mine is. He's asked me to design him a super kick-ass slave computer to replace his three quad-core slave machines that run on 1Gbe ethernet that feed into Cubase. So far I've settled on these specs:

Anyone else is welcome to weigh in as well. I want input on things like core-count vs. core-speed, issues with CPU bottlenecking, and threads per instance.

Posted on Tue, Feb 18 2020 18:29
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Hi Trickytrick,

You are welcome. I wonder why you've selected a server CPU? This is not obvious to me at all. Also, I don't really understand the question about threads per instance. It's just a number of cores times two. Or you meant something else that I didn't quite grasp.

Cheers,

Crusoe.

Posted on Tue, Feb 18 2020 21:56
by trickytick
Joined on Fri, Feb 14 2020, Posts 6

Good Q. I'd rather have gone with a desktop-level processor, but he wants 256GB of RAM. All desktop processor memory controllers top-out at 128GB (except for the Intel i9-10980XE which is very likely the last of its socket-type and won't be upgradeable).

Threads per instance" is a setting within the CuBase/VSL ecosystem that determines how MIDI channels are handled. However, I'm not very familiar with it and want to make sure it won't become a bottleneck at some point.

Posted on Wed, Feb 19 2020 12:07
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Ok, then I guess you need not concern yourself with the thread number. I don't know how it works exactly, but it's more or less a resource management thing. Any CPU of the grade you are aiming at is not a bottleneck. Not even remotely. This CPU will sit 97% idle in the stratospehere, while mere mortals, memory chips, SSDs and the like are trying to pull of the mighty feat of moving around those 256Gb of data.

The shopping list looks fine to me. You might want to consider the newer Threadripper 3970X, although it has higher TDP, which is enough to substitute a fireplace, if your client needs one. Also, the audio interface could become a bottleneck, depending on what your client has right now. Samsungs are a good choice, btw, I'm not convinced by the performance of the new PCIe 4.0 modules. But this will probably change in the future.

Good luck :)

Crusoe.

Posted on Wed, Feb 19 2020 18:59
by trickytick
Joined on Fri, Feb 14 2020, Posts 6

Haha, threadripper was the first chip I Googled for this project. Unfortunately, *while it does support 256GB of RAM, it's 2x the price of the EPYC chip that I selected. Feedback appreciated though.

Posted on Thu, Feb 20 2020 11:00
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

I've just had a look here:

https://www.cpu-monkey.com/en/compare_cpu-amd_epyc_7302-996-vs-amd_ryzen_threadripper_3970x-948

TR price is substantially lower, must be a different model pair that you looked at. Nevertheless, this page gives a pretty good idea of the comparative performance. 

All the best,

Crusoe.

Posted on Thu, Feb 20 2020 17:12
by trickytick
Joined on Fri, Feb 14 2020, Posts 6

Thank you for checking!

However, the price listed on that site is wildly inaccurate. Check out both products on Newegg.com:

I used CPU-Monkey for some of my research, so I'm glad that you pointed this out. I will not be going back to them as often now.

Posted on Thu, Feb 20 2020 17:16
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 131

Holy ... Thanks for pointing this out :)

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