Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Forum Jump  
Another Nelhybel for concert band
Last post Sat, Feb 08 2020 by William, 12 replies.
Options
Go to last post
Posted on Tue, Jan 14 2020 02:10
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5509

This is my favorite of Nelhybels pieces - I am posting this because VSL can be used just as much for concert band music as orchestral.  I first heard this years ago and stopped dead in my tracks listening to it, because it was shockingly different from the usual pleasant conventional band music one normally hears.    

TRITTICO

Posted on Tue, Jan 14 2020 08:48
by MMKA
Joined on Tue, May 22 2012, Posts 363
This is great music. I can imagine also a real pleasure to play it. Thanks for sharing this (this piece but alsof the 10 trombone piece).
Posted on Wed, Jan 15 2020 15:50
by Acclarion
Joined on Sat, Aug 15 2015, Canada, Eh!, Posts 513

Yet another gem.  This is a powerful and intense work and an eye opener to the diversity of concert band rep, especially for those of us that are quite ignorant to what's out there, beyond the conventional rep as you mentioned.

www.DavidCarovillano.com - NEW SITE!
www.acclarion.ca - concert accordion & clarinet duo
Posted on Sat, Jan 18 2020 02:47
by tchampe
Joined on Wed, Apr 25 2018, Posts 71
Great, I lost my brilliant thoughts when I tried to cut and paste them from another thread. Too bad; it was quite witty and brilliant. Suffice it to say that I was a bit disappointed when I realized Bill hadn’t actually done a midistration of Trittico. He’s probably sick of hearing me say this, but I’d love to hear him put his VSL powers to a performance of one of these classic band works or, better yet, one of his own. At least it’s a good sign that he’s thinking about the work of great band composers like Nelhybel. Maybe it will lead to him giving it a try. Here’s hoping!
Posted on Sat, Jan 18 2020 14:44
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5509

It would be something to do one of Nelhybel's works with MIDI !     I'd like to, or especially do The Sinfonians my favorite band piece which doesn't have a lot of good recordings.  I did a concert march of my own for full band. But - though Tom knows all about this, playing in band -  it is way harder to do MIDI for symphonic band than orchestra.  Think of how the strings make up most of an orchestra - and that's only five parts!   With symphonic band all the instruments are different and there are doublings you have to use even if they aren't necessarily wanted.  Here is a standard list:

Piccolo

1st Flute (usually doubled)

2nd Flute (etc.)

Oboe

Cor Anglais (English Horn)

Bassoon

Eb Clarinet

Solo Bb Clarinet

Clarinet Ensembles:

1st Bb Clarinet

2nd Bb Clarinet

3rd Bb Clarinet

Alto Clarinet

Bass Clarinet

Soprano Saxophone

1st Alto Saxophone

2nd Alto Saxophone

Tenor Saxophone

Baritone Saxophone

1st Bb Trumpet

2nd Bb Trumpet

3rd Bb Trumpet

1st Bb Cornet

2nd Bb Cornet

3rd Bb Cornet

Flugel Horn

1st French Horn

2nd French Horn

3rd French Horn

4th French Horn

1st Tenor Trombone

2nd Tenor Trombone

Bass Trombone

Euphonium

Tubas (Eb, Bb)

Percussion (including optional but normally used instruments)

Drum Kit

Bass Drum

Snare Drum

Cymbals

Triangle

Tambourine

Wood Block

Bongos

Claves

Gong

Tam-tam

Timpani

Glockenspiel

Xylophone

Marimba

Vibraphone

Chimes

Posted on Sat, Jan 18 2020 18:31
by tchampe
Joined on Wed, Apr 25 2018, Posts 71

Well Bill, never let it be said that you don't know how to make a point. That's a lot of stuff. Still, since confession is supposedly good for the soul, I might as well say it: that's what I want to do. I want to write stuff for symphoic band and hear what it would sound like if one of the great wind bands performed it. I have been lurking around this company's website and others for years, pricing the libraries, DAW software, specialized computer, and peripherals I would need to do it. Even if I suddenly could get all that stuff, I am probably too old to live through the learning curve, but I keep dreaming. The fact that virtually no one (even other band enthusiasts) would ever so much as listen to it is discouraging, but not a deal breaker. I would listen to it. They say that Elgar, as he lay dying in his country home, would listen to recordings of his own works. I get that. Of course those recordings were done by the finest musicians and ensembles; he had enthusiastic fans the world over and was greatly honored. I will have none of that. But with this remarkable technology, I could hear what I imagine.

So, as the Cowardly Lion once said, "There's just one thing I want you fellas to do...TALK ME OUT OF IT!"

Posted on Sun, Jan 19 2020 02:34
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5509

Tom,  I don't mean to sound negative, just was explaining why I haven't done any concert band material.  In other words, wimping out. 

I totally agree about doing serious concert band recordings, also, I've realized the lack of specific band ensembles in VSL is not a problem, since the 3 clarinet ensemble can be doubled or tripled, and there are two additional solo clarinets which each can be doubled.  And of couse all the other instruments are there.  

I was going to do a new mix of my concert march, designed to destroy the embochures of horn players, but didn't get to it.  But now all I can say is "talk me out of it!"

Posted on Sun, Jan 19 2020 23:04
by Acclarion
Joined on Sat, Aug 15 2015, Canada, Eh!, Posts 513

Originally Posted by: tchampe Go to Quoted Post

I have been lurking around this company's website and others for years, pricing the libraries, DAW software, specialized computer, and peripherals I would need to do it. Even if I suddenly could get all that stuff, I am probably too old to live through the learning curve, but I keep dreaming. The fact that virtually no one (even other band enthusiasts) would ever so much as listen to it is discouraging, but not a deal breaker. I would listen to it. They say that Elgar, as he lay dying in his country home, would listen to recordings of his own works. I get that. Of course those recordings were done by the finest musicians and ensembles; he had enthusiastic fans the world over and was greatly honored. I will have none of that. But with this remarkable technology, I could hear what I imagine.

So, as the Cowardly Lion once said, "There's just one thing I want you fellas to do...TALK ME OUT OF IT!"

As I said a while back, you absolutely should take the plunge, Tom!  There will be no regret trying to bring the tunes in your head to life via virtual performances.  You surely will learn and grow with the instruments, and unleash a level of creativity that will surprise you.  You're not too old to learn...be patient with yourself and within a matter of months you'll be well on your way.  Within a couple of years, you'll be a Champ(e)!  Couldn't resist :)

As for nobody listening to it, as you mentioned, you'll listen and I suspect you'll have more supporters/admirers/fans than you realize, especially since the music you propose to write is popular, but under-served in the VSL world.  

Take it from someone who knows:  it's a heck of a lot more fun doing this stuff FOR FUN than it is trying to be a "professional."

Good luck to you!

p.s.  William:  same goes to you re. your concert march...get on it because you clearly have fans that want to hear it!

www.DavidCarovillano.com - NEW SITE!
www.acclarion.ca - concert accordion & clarinet duo
Posted on Wed, Feb 05 2020 16:25
by Paul McGraw
Joined on Mon, Feb 29 2016, Georgia, USA, Posts 422

Originally Posted by: tchampe Go to Quoted Post

Well Bill, never let it be said that you don't know how to make a point. That's a lot of stuff. Still, since confession is supposedly good for the soul, I might as well say it: that's what I want to do. I want to write stuff for symphoic band and hear what it would sound like if one of the great wind bands performed it. I have been lurking around this company's website and others for years, pricing the libraries, DAW software, specialized computer, and peripherals I would need to do it. Even if I suddenly could get all that stuff, I am probably too old to live through the learning curve, but I keep dreaming. The fact that virtually no one (even other band enthusiasts) would ever so much as listen to it is discouraging, but not a deal breaker. I would listen to it. They say that Elgar, as he lay dying in his country home, would listen to recordings of his own works. I get that. Of course those recordings were done by the finest musicians and ensembles; he had enthusiastic fans the world over and was greatly honored. I will have none of that. But with this remarkable technology, I could hear what I imagine.

So, as the Cowardly Lion once said, "There's just one thing I want you fellas to do...TALK ME OUT OF IT!"

I am 66 years old. I have Congestive Heart Failure, OCPD, and Cancer. Which will kill me first? Only my God knows which or how long it will take. But I still take great joy in trying to write music. And writing music is a great activity for a senior with limited mobility, as you can do it all sitting down, and take your time writing all day or for just a few minutes a day.

Thankfully samples are getting cheaper, even VSL, and the bundles are a great way to start with VSL on a budget. But another way to get started is to use a notation program (Sibelius, Dorico or Finale) and use the plugin "NotePerformer" for the playback. I think in notation. There is no way I could write anything directly to a DAW. So personally I write in Sibelius using NotePerformer to make sure I am writing what I think I am writing, then only later record with samples in a DAW. The extra step of playing it into a DAW is fun for me, and I get as close to a real performance as possible.

Don't wait, just get started. Have fun with it! Composing has no calories! 

Posted on Wed, Feb 05 2020 16:29
by Paul McGraw
Joined on Mon, Feb 29 2016, Georgia, USA, Posts 422

Originally Posted by: William Go to Quoted Post

This is my favorite of Nelhybels pieces - I am posting this because VSL can be used just as much for concert band music as orchestral.  I first heard this years ago and stopped dead in my tracks listening to it, because it was shockingly different from the usual pleasant conventional band music one normally hears.    

TRITTICO

Thanks William, another really memorable piece of music by Nellybels. You know the Brass Band world has a number of prominent composers with a similar style. Of course, they do not use the French Horn in a Brass Band. The parts that would go to a French Horn are mostly in Eb Alto/Tenor horn, and sometimes also in Baritone. Not the same tone at all.

Posted on Fri, Feb 07 2020 19:45
by tchampe
Joined on Wed, Apr 25 2018, Posts 71

Originally Posted by: Paul McGraw Go to Quoted Post

I am 66 years old. I have Congestive Heart Failure, OCPD, and Cancer. Which will kill me first? Only my God knows which or how long it will take. But I still take great joy in trying to write music. And writing music is a great activity for a senior with limited mobility, as you can do it all sitting down, and take your time writing all day or for just a few minutes a day.

Paul,

I am so sorry that you are struggling with such serious health issues at this time of your life, Paul. I only know you through your posts, our limited correspondence, and your music, but that is enough for me to confidently say that I know you to be a man of faith, courage, and character, all of which will carry you through this difficult trial.

I always enjoy your music and look forward to your next piece; your skills with the virtual orchestra grow with each new effort. Courage, and all my best wishes to you, my friend.

Tom

Posted on Sat, Feb 08 2020 17:49
by William
Joined on Sun, Nov 24 2002, USA, Posts 5509

Really agree with that - a number of Paul's pieces I love and want in my music library!  They should be in the orchestral repertoire but how to do that nowadays?  Almost impossible.   

One thing Tom mentioned to me is how while orchestras - which are highly dysfunctional today in many ways - are endlessly playing the same warhorses over and over, totally ignoring any contact with new composers except those who schmooze successfully or perhaps blackmail a conductor -  concert bands are actually looking for new material.  Can you imagine such a thing?  Since I have a past in concert band I am thinking hard about how some pieces of mine are suited to it, just as much as orchestra. 

I find Nelhybel really inspiring because he was so serious in exploiting the sonic characteristics of the symphonic band, which is different from orchestra - it has much more raw power than any orchestra can ever have because of the massive concentration of brass and winds.  R. Strauss and Mahler - even though people don't tend to think of them this way - were attempting to do something similar to what is present in a large symphonic band by increasing the size of the brass and wind ensembles, but even in their orchestrations it is not as large.       

You cannot post new threads in this forum.
You cannot reply to threads in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.