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Issue with AMD Ryzen 3900k and VE Pro 7 Plugin
Last post Thu, May 14 2020 by MS, 7 replies.
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Posted on Fri, Mar 13 2020 21:52
by fantasiom_3945
Joined on Fri, Nov 14 2003, Posts 12

So I've been doing a direct comparison with my current Intel Core i7-7820X and the AMD Ryzen 3900x and an issue has cropped up in regards to Vienna Ensemble Pro 7.  I've been able to narrow down the cause to VEPro the number of output/inputs that you allow in the preferences of the VEPro Plugin.  So basically on the AMD machine the more outputs/inputs that you allow for the plugin causes the cpu utilization to increase a lot more than on an intel machine therefore the performance in cubase 10.0 goes down significantly.  The plugin doesn't even have to be connected to a server. 

I tested this by just opening a blank cubase session and loading 25 VEPro VST3 Instrument tracks (not connected to any server).  I had the preferences for the plugin set at 512 outputs, 32 midi ports, and 64 inputs (this is an output configuration that I've used for 5 years now).  The intel machine was idling at 4% cpu utilization and after the plugins were added it increased to 15% utilization, with the performance meter in cubase moving up about 1/10 of the way up.  So very negligible considering how extreme the case is, it seems the intel machine doesn't care how many outputs or inputs I would choose. 

Doing this same thing on the AMD Ryzen machine was very different.  The cpu utilization was around 4% again on idle but once the plugins were added the utlization went up to 90%!  And the performance meter in cubase was almost to the top and about the clip.

I then did the same test changing the outputs and intputs to just 2 and the cpu utilization was negligible on both machines.  So it's definitely related to the output/input structure

So am I missing something?  There aren't many options to choose from on the plugin side and it's particularly interesting that the plugins aren't even connected to anything.  just loading them in causes the cpu to spike significantly on the AMD machine where the intel dooesn't take the same hit.  Is this related to the AMD processor?  Technically the AMD processor is more powerful than the intel but the results of this test are bizarre.    

To normalize this, I should mention for everything else the Ryzen performs better.  Kontakt, Omnisphere, Fabfilter, etc....adding a bunch of local plugins and instrumetns to tax the system, the ryzen performs about 15-20% better than the intel.  But for VEPro, it cripples the Ryzen.  It would great if I could figure out why.  Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Here are the more specific specs of the systems:

Intel Core i-7 7820X, Cubase 10.0.50, Windows 10 1909, 64 GB ram.  Hyperthreading and Turbo boost disabled. UR824 Interface, Yamaha drivers (most recent).  VEPro 7.0.922

AMD Ryzen 3900X, Cubase 10.0.50, Windows 10 1909, 128 GB ram, SMT and Turbo Core disabled.  (same resultes with enabled).  UR824 Interface, Yamaha drivers (most recent) 7.0.922.  This was also tested with 7.0.973 but same result.

Posted on Sun, Mar 22 2020 15:51
by Novatlan
Joined on Mon, Oct 12 2009, Bingen, Germany, Posts 170


I can confirm this. Seeing the same on my Threadripper 3970X.

The amount of aux channels determines the ASIO load in Cubase. Everything else has barely any effect.

PC i7 3930K, 64GB Ram, RME Fireface UCX, Win 10 Pro
Posted on Mon, Mar 23 2020 12:15
by bbelius
Joined on Sat, Mar 14 2015, Posts 883


Thanks for your tests and detailed problem descriptions. I have talked with our development just now about this issue.
We try to get hold of such a machine to continue investigation.

In the mean-time, to shorten the investiagtion time as soon as our machine arrives, could you please test following scenarios and report your results:
- Does it male a difference to change the Cubase audio-engine to 32-/64-bit (How-To switch)?
- Do you use any kind of convolution reverb inside VEP? Does removing all these plugins / disable convolution in VEP and hosted plugins change the load?
- Do you use any instrument-plugins in your test-session and which are these?

Thanks for your patience and testing!

Best, Ben

Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Mon, Mar 30 2020 02:09
by fantasiom_3945
Joined on Fri, Nov 14 2003, Posts 12

sorry for the delay, been a bit distracted given the global events.  However I was able to take a look at your questions:

64/32.  It make a big difference.  The problem is worse at 64 bit.  32 bit, seems to reduce the problem but it's hard to quantify exactly.  

As for your last two questions there are no other inserts, plugins, or instruments used in my test session.  It's a blank cubase session with just the 25 disconnected instances of vep loaded as instrument tracks, or racks.  With the load increasing a lot if a lot of ouputs/inputs are used.  


Posted on Wed, May 06 2020 13:19
by rossbr
Joined on Sat, Apr 08 2017, Posts 1

I am considering building a AMD Ryzen system for plugin hosting and would like to know if the issue outlined by the OP still exist.

It would be a sizable investment for me and I'd be very disapointed if the AMD system was hamstrung by platform issues.


Posted on Wed, May 06 2020 13:30
by bbelius
Joined on Sat, Mar 14 2015, Posts 883

(My personal advice: Wait a few months for the next generation of AMD CPUs. The next gen mobile CPUs that were released are looking just awsome price/performance.)

Regarding VEP: We are currently working on an update that is in testing, that also contains some performance improvements for AMD's Ryzen CPUs. As soon as it is out I would like to hear your feedback :)

Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Thu, May 14 2020 16:33
by MS
Joined on Wed, Feb 19 2003, Vienna, Austria, Posts 1762

With version 1048, released today, you should see a considerable improvement in this load with many active Aux channels.

Martin Saleteg
Software Developer
Vienna Symphonic Library GmbH
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