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Posted on Mon, Jun 05 2023 14:10
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

What's happened is ....

No matter what Articulation is showing loaded in Vienna Ensemble Pro / Synchron player driven by a track in Logic during playback of all ready recorded material as soon as I play a note from a keyboard, Synchron player calls up the Short Notes Staccato patch.

I'm no longer able to play anything other than Staccato notes in real time.

I'm lost as to what parameter controls this. (obviously I'm not playing any notes associated with Key-switches)

Posted on Wed, Jun 07 2023 11:21
by Andreas8420
Joined on Mon, Dec 02 2019, Vienna, Posts 353


Articulations are controlled & selected via MIDI data. Does the same issue come up when opening the standalone applications? Also, does it make a difference if you create a fresh Logic song and check the behavior there?

Best regards,

Technical Support - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Wed, Jun 07 2023 15:35
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

Many thanks for your reply, Yes the same in a new track - BUT - narrowing it down slightly I think it has to do with Babylon Waves - does anyone know if the way Babylon Waves selects Articulations in Logic is somehow different to what the VSL Synchron player expects - it's almost as if the Articulation is 'latched' onto the note and the moment I play a note in realtime I generate a note that has no Babylon Waves Articulation setting and this causes Synchron to reset to a 'Default' ?

Is this possible ?

Is anyone using Babylon  Waves here ?

Posted on Wed, Jun 07 2023 18:26
by plowman
Joined on Sat, Dec 13 2003, Posts 1175

Hello Louis, 

I do not have Babylon Waves. But as I read your posts, I think Logic's behavior here may need clarifying. Apologies if you already know the following. 

Logic is my only DAW (for better or worse), and I routinely hit the keyboard only to hear an inevitable staccato -- the left-most dimension / top-most patch slot of Synchron in factory presets, and consequently the first item in our Articulation list. 

Your recorded material has articulations embedded in the note. But they have nothing to do with what you play live. Open Logic's plug-in window for your Synchron Strings pro track. It most likely points to the staccato patch you hear. 

That's what you're going to get playing your MIDI keyboard. What's in your pre-recorded regions is irrelevant. 

Now go to a Piano Roll window displaying a region and click on a note. In Piano Roll's Local Inspector (assuming the window is high enough to show "Articulation"), you'll see the name of the articulation assigned to the note selected. The "live" selection in the plug-in window is completely separate from that. 

Now de-select any and all notes in Piano Roll. PR's Articulation box will probably revert to the live input note -- most likely the first articulation in your list (often staccato).

If (with no pre-recorded notes selected), you choose a different articulation in PR, that should become the live input articulation, and the articulation displayed in the plug-in window should update. 

Equally, if you select a new articulation in the plug-in window, the PR Articulation should update -- but only if no pre-recorded note is selected in PR. That's always the catch. 

It would be more elegant and helpful if PR had two entries for Articulation: one for "Selected Note" and another for "Live Input." 


Posted on Thu, Jun 08 2023 22:47
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

Many many thanks for the clarification.

That's REALLY unfortunate.


Ok - Time to re-evaluate my work flow -  !

I've grown to really hate Keyswitches .... inspite of them being incredibly useful .. and thought with Babylon wave's approach I'd found a way round them ... but clearly not.

Posted on Fri, Jun 09 2023 17:40
by plowman
Joined on Sat, Dec 13 2003, Posts 1175

I understand your frustration. Keyswitches are indeed a two-edged sword.

One last thought, and this you may already be doing: 

We share the "d'oh!" moment, like listen to a minute's playback of legato violins, have a sudden creative idea, play the keyboard and get the barking sound of staccato. And then you turn into an octopus: reaching, adjusting, mousing, drop-downing, item browsing... and what was my creative idea again? 

The fast solution to this is remote keyswitches -- assigning the most commonly played articulations to buttons on your controller. I have these splayed out in front of me using a very small Novation Launchkey Mini. The remote keyswitches -- assigned in Logic's Articulation Editor -- immediately choose *live* input sounds. 

So > creative thought > play > staccato > d'oh! > smack button twelve (assigned to legato) > get on with it. 

That is the fastest way I know to move beyond the hear-recorded / play-live workflow. 

Posted on Fri, Jun 09 2023 20:49
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

That's a very useful idea.

I'll take a look - obviously I've just been thinking about those type of controllers as better suited to work with Ableton  - but thinking about the Synchron player layout they are actually ideal candidates.

Many thanks.

Posted on Sun, Jun 25 2023 19:11
by petmar
Joined on Sat, Jun 11 2022, Sweden, Posts 10


Posted on Sun, Jun 25 2023 19:14
by petmar
Joined on Sat, Jun 11 2022, Sweden, Posts 10


Posted on Tue, Jul 04 2023 19:36
by Mavros
Joined on Mon, Apr 19 2021, Switzerland, Posts 65
If you have iPad there are several options to live switch articulations. The problem is that some VSL libraries have more than 256 articulations which is Logic maximum. However you can of course limit your push button grid to your favorites..

As you have Art Conductor you can get Metagrid Pro (payed version) for your IPad and Metaserver and PlugSearch on your Mac. Costs about 65 Euro total. With that combination you can change a huge number of VSL articulations for all libraries in Art Conductor while playing and also in the piano roll. You probably received an advertisement from Babylon a week or sonago.
Posted on Tue, Jul 04 2023 22:51
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

Sadly I have exactly that combination and whilst MetagridPro is displaying the name of the BabylonWaves Articulation Set and descriptor it's not managing to parse the Button graphics so it's blank screen and Logo territory for me on that route so far.

It is however a promising approach but three independent developers aiming for ongoing compatibility and stability ... .I


It rarely works.




Posted on Wed, Jul 05 2023 06:26
by Mavros
Joined on Mon, Apr 19 2021, Switzerland, Posts 65
Hi Louis
I had the same issue and nearly gave up on the app combination but the PlugSearch developer gave me the solution., In the controler surface setup in Logic for Metagrid you have to set both in and output to PlugSeach. and most important you have to keep the articulation set directory exactly as you download it from Babylon including the top directory called Art Director, copy and set the scan path in PlugSearch to that directory, You then rescan and the issue should go away. I would say it works 95% of the time. To make the scan go faster, you can delete all subdirectories for libraries you do not have but you should not move anything.

If you switch back and forth between tracks and especially if there is a track without articulation set in between you might still get the screen you mentioned from time to time. To get it loaded correctly you just need to define a key command in PlugSearch for Refresh Metagrid. I use option+command+M. If you get the infamous empty screen with only the name of the library and articulation or the one stating the library is unsupported you push that combination and the gird loads. I even made a functioning grid for Synchron Harp as Art Conductor does not have that (they will add it soon they say).

It is rather new and indeed still needs some development to make it 100% stable. Before this I used TouchOSC but that became very buggy after they updated it. My old grids still works perfectly with the old app. I use Metagrid also as remote for Dorico.

On the other hand if you have a 100% working hardware solution which has enough buttons to cover your favorite articulations that is probably better although the Logic Controller Surface setup is not the best and also regularly has its issues. At least once per Logic session my transport buttons on my KK keyboard stop working and I have to turn it off and on to make it work again.
Posted on Thu, Jul 06 2023 10:17
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73


            many thanks for taking the time.

Sadly I've been through all the steps you suggest including assigning a keystroke to Update Metagrid from within PlugSearch but I'm still getting the same result - the Screen still only shows two things:

The VSL Library name along with the selected Articulation

and in the middle of the screen:


It's clearly going to be a simple fix ... just a case of getting there.

I'm using the Articulation sets for Logic so my Master Folder is USER/Music/Audio Music Apps/Art Conductor Logic/VSL etc etc

That apart I have everything set as you descibe .. and I've 'reached out' to support and so fingers crossed.

Any pother suggestions for a fix ?

Posted on Sat, Jul 15 2023 11:02
by Louis C
Joined on Fri, Sep 22 2017, Posts 73

I'm still unable to see the Articulations with Art Conductor


I now have a dialogue telling me:

The file 'Art Conductor.artcon' is missing in the folder '/Users/*******/Music/Audio Music Apps/Articulation Settings/🅱️ Art Conductor Logic'.

Can anyone who's using Art Conductor shed any light on what this file is and where it should be ?

I have downloaded and re-installed AGAIN ... you only get  a few download allocations with the BabylonWaves license so this is in and of itself disconcerting ... but a fresh install has simply generated the above error .. however i wasn't getting that error message with my previous install .....

As always any pointers would be most welcome.

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