Hi Stephen

You can download my HP prefs for SE and some VSL download instruments from here

http://forum.makemusic.com/default.aspx?f=6&m=283077

best

A.S.

Found an interesting article on the Finale blog how the music for the TV show "The Event" is put together.

http://www.finalemusic.com/blog/post/2011/03/22/Finale-Collaborating-on-Music-for-Television-and-The-Event.aspx

It is in 2 parts, this is just the first one.

I'm not working with film music myself but I thought it might be of interest to some of you.

"Contemporary Harmony - Romanticism through the Twelwe-Tone Row" by Ludmila Uhlela (Advance Music) is a very good book with lots of examples.

Persichetti is also a good book. (I saw someone recommended this one previous)

We used both when I studied at the conservatory.

Bill,

this thread might be useful for you: http://community.vsl.co.at/forums/t/24478.aspx

And I assume a video with Finale and VE is in the works? ;-)

Paul:

I also have Vienna Ensemble 3 showing up in eLCC after using the codes for VE Pro and downloading the permanent license. I was told by VSL that this was correct when I bought VE Pro this spring.

However, I also had license problems a week ago. Suddenly I was told that my license for VE Pro had expired (although it was showing up correct in eLCC). If I tried to download the permanent license again with the first code I was told this code was already used.

I did not have time to fiddle with this so I just used the second license code and now it works.

It seems to be a glitch with eLcc at the moment that you might want to look into.

/A

Hi Andie,

I'm sorry to report that the problem with CC#11 data is not being sent on phrases that start with shorter note values and don't contain any hairpins still exist in Finale 2011. We discussed this bug in HP in private mails earlier this spring.

Do you know if MM is working on this bug as well?

thanks

Albert

There is a free program called Audio Unit Manager that lets you "turn off" specific VST/AUs for different applications.

I used this program with Finale 2008 for this reason. Works really well and is easy to use.

Thanks Dietz,

they are not chromatic I'm afraid...I'm using Mac OS as well so they need to be in AU. And 64-bit. And free...

Am I the only person who thinks that chromatic Cowbells are a fantastic instrument??

(well I know Thomas Adés likes them too. That makes two of us. Anyone else?)

I'm desperately in the need for cowbells for my current score. I'm looking for (chromatic) tuned cowbells used in orchestral percussion with at least an octave span.

I know there are cowbells in th extended library of the full percussion DVD-box. But €715 seems a little much just for cowbells at the moment...

I have SE, and SE strings+ and a couple of DL wind/brass. It doesn't seem to be any cowbells in my VSL libraries. Or have I missed them?

Does anyone know where to find (relatively) cheap cowbells?

Thanks

A

PS. I also have Kontakt 2 (will have Kontakt 4 in couple of days), GPO 4.0 and Xsample Chamber Ens. Are there cowbells in any of these I have missed?

I just discovered that Finale 2011 is available for pre-order. From the read-me file about Fin2011 you can read:

Human Playback
Human Playback no longer causes unexpected CC11 data.

Errors regarding inserting keyswitches have been resolved.

Dynamics now play back correctly with Garritan Sound Effects.

The interpretation of trill accidentals has been improved.

Additional instruments including harpsichord and accordion are now supported.

I don't know if this will solve any Finale/VSL problems discussed in this thread but one can always hope... ;-)

Fin låt. Och väldigt bra pianospel.

cheers from fridhemsplan

Great. Thanks!

Sorry if this has been discussed earlier but I got really different results when googling this...

Will I be able to run Kontakt 4 in VE Pro 64-bit (standalone)? Mac Pro with Mac OS 10.6.3. The NI site seems to say no...(?)

http://www.native-instruments.com/en/support/compatibility/mac-os-x-compatibility/

"For the time being, Native Instruments does not recommend using 64bit kernel mode with music production software. The development efforts necessary to establish 64bit kernel mode compatibility for NI products are currently being evaluated."

I have an orchestral template in VE Pro with only VSL instruments that I need to complement with some Kontakt sounds and I would really like to have all sounds in one instance (and not have to run a second VE Pro instance in 32 bit).

Any first hand experience here?

Mac Pro 2x2.8 Ghz, Mac OS 10.6.3

Running VE Pro (64 bit) as one standalone instance and sending midi via IAC-buses from host.

Just a quick word about changing notation software.

Most users on this forum (and probably the majority of VSL users?) are mainly concerned with playback. Some are professional film composers and use VSL as a part of their "end product".

BUT:

Most professional users of Finale use this software because of the more or less unlimited possibilities to edit your notated score. Playback is appreciated but not essential for engravers, copyists, composers (of concert music) etc.

It is highly unlikely for these users to switch to another notation software just because playback with a certain library is not working. Especially if they have worked with Finale for 15-20 years and all their scores are in Finale-format. They will change to another library instead.

And since there are a lot of question marks concerning how well Finale and VSL integrates, many notation pros hesitate to purchase VSL products. At least, this is my experience from the Finale forums and how my composer colleagues are thinking.

I think that VSL and Finale could be a great combination for both professional users and hobbyists. It just needs some more development, both from Finale (ie MakeMusic) and VSL.

Will it be possible to stretch the highest or lowest samples to extend the range of an instrument? (Like you can in Kontakt)

For those of us who compose concert music (ie music that will be played by real ensembles or orchestras in the end) this would be an invaluable option.

Thanks Andi for your information, things are becoming a lot clearer now. I had some contact with Robert some years ago on the Northern Sounds forum where he helped me out with a few things. He IS a difficult person to get in touch with (I have also tried and failed a couple of times). I'm not sure why. Maybe he's to busy or maybe he is not interested, I really don't know.

Although Robert is the creator of Finale's playback engine "Human Playback" it would be a shame if it were impossible to combine two of the most advanced music applications available (VSL & Finale) just because one person doesn't respond to an e-mail? Don't you agree? Is there a plan B? :-)

I'm glad to hear that! ;-)

Do you mean sending a keyswitch and a CC value at the same time? (To move vertically in the VI matrix)

What doesn't work? I've had problems when the CC#1 value would revert to zero a little to early sometimes and therefore causing hanging notes. Is that what you have experienced?

Any problems like this is connected to Human Playback and I guess you have contacted Robert P directly as well? Sometimes I get the feeling that MakeMusic and Robert don't communicate that well... ;-)

Open letter to VSL:

First I want to express my gratitude to Andi and his work with VSL and different notation programs. This is great and he has a great knowledge on both VSL and Sibelius/Finale/Cubase etc.

My concern is the lack of attention for those who are using VSL and Finale. This is not a problem for myself as I have worked with this combination a couple of years now and have managed to develop a workflow that works more or less ok for the Vienna Instruments I use in my work. I have previously posted some expanded Finale HP prefs on this site together with some general tips and tricks for Finale/VSL.

The problem is that I'm very often contacted by composers, both from my country both also from people seeking advice from all around the world, who want to know more about using VSL together with Finale. I was contacted by a very successful composer some time ago (who is played by orchestras all around the world) and he was about to upgrade his entire studio. Money was not an issue... He told me he wanted the best combination with Finale that money could buy! I gave him some general advice on computer hardware and also explaned how I work but in the end I had to dissuade him from getting VSL.

The main problem was that I felt that currently VSL is focusing on Sibelius and Cubase and there is really not that much support for the Finale users. Sibelius has Soundsets for the entire Cube and Cubase is not far behind. Finale has only HP prefs for Vienna SE and those were posted two years ago (at least). There is also no guide like the "Optimizing Sibelius Playback" for Finale. Like I said earlier, this is not something I need myself, but if I shall recommend VSL as a valid option for Finale, I want to be sure that those who invest money and time in this really gets something that work "out of the box". I'm also rather active on the MakeMusic Finale forum and I'm constantly asked by other members how VSL and Finale work together. At the moment I say that VSL is a fantastic library but there is not that much attention and development from VSL. But I hope this may change?

Best wishes

Albert

Hi Paul,

thanks for the reply. The size of the ensembles I write for vary a lot. I write for everything from solo instrument to full orchestra. It depends on the commission. My main computer in my studio is a Mac Pro 2x2,8 Ghz with 10 GB RAM and this machine is working really well for the projects I've had so far. My main concern was if the new MacBook Pros (with the new i5/i7 processors) would be capable of handling an orchestral score. I will probably upgrade my "home" laptop in the near future and I was wondering if it would be worth the extra cash to go for the top machines if that would enable me to run VSL with that computer as well.

It would be interesting to know more about your colleagues new Lenovo laptop. Is it a quadcore or a dualcore? How many Vienna Instruments would it be able to play without MIR (just using Vienna Suite reverb for example)?

I'm also really interested in the VSL performance if anyone at VSL get a chance to try out the new MacBook Pros.

Thanks

Albert

(Still no answer from VSL... hmm, this thread is beginning to feel more like a blog or something... ;-) )

Anyway, here's a test that was published on barefeats.com last friday comparing the new i5/i7 MacBooks with an iMac i7 and a MacBook Pro C2D.

While the test showed an increased performance from the previous generation of MacBooks with C2D they are still way behind an iMac i7 or any MacPro. This is their conclusion:

These test results seem to suggest that the new i5/i7 MacBooks are NOT capable of playing an orchestral score live (say 30 Vienna instruments). Especially not from a notation programs such as Finale or Sibelius. (I know there are workarounds in DAWs such as Logic where you can freeze tracks etc to optimize playback. What I'm talking about here is how many Vienna instruments a MacBook Pro are capable of playing LIVE.)

Does anyone else care to comment on these test results?

Bump.

I understand that noone can give firsthand information about the new MacBook Pros since they are just released.

What I'm asking for is if someone at VSL could give a qualified guess of what performance we could expect of a dualcore i5 or i7? Surely VSL must have made tests with PCs with i5/i7 (dual or quad)?

Is it realistic at all to expect that a laptop would perform somewhere near a desktop (such as the MacPro) even with a quadcore i7 processor?

Can anyone at Vienna give us some estimation of the performance of the new MacBooks with i5/i7 proc?

In my studio I have a MacPro but at home I have a MacBook (2006) that I use mainly for internet/mail but occasionally also for composing. Since not even the topline MacBook pros can handle an orchestral score played realtime from Finale using VSL I have waited for the new processors to arrive.

My main concern with this new MacBooks is that though they are i5 or I7 they are still only dualcore. Will there be a significant improvement in performance with VSL anyway? Or should I wait for a quadcore MacBook if I want, lets say 25-30 VIs from Finale (bare in mind that Finale is a CPU beast as well)?

Hi Andi,

I'm picking up this thread again. I'm having a similar problem in Finale2010. I'm currently writing a Cello Concerto and the most important instrument, ie the solo cello, does not sustain. The problem is that it is not possible to exclude a tie from playback in Finale.

I'm not sure if "tie" and "slur" are the same in Sibelius? In Finale, "slur" are something you attach with the Smart Shape Tool (for legato for example). This slur looks different from a "tie" (made with the Speedy/Simple Entry Tool) and to "fake" a tie with a slur would take endless layout adjusting.

Any suggestions how to solve this in Finale?

bbesse78_20408:

- Do you use the HP prefs for Finale that VSL supplies? These prefs will trigger all keyswitches for you and it will also use CC#11 for volume changes (instead of CC#7).

- When exporting a midi file from Finale, make sure you apply the HP plugin from the plug-in meny first. AND, most important, click on Preferences in the window that will appear and choose the VSL prefs again (even if they were chosen in the playback window). This is a minor bug in Finale and if you don't choose the VSL prefs in this step Finale will instead apply the default prefs made for GPO (that means incorrect keyswitches and volume is controlled by CC#7 instead of CC#11).

- When opening the midi-file in Logic (and maybe Cubase too?) it is most important that you OPEN the file and not IMPORT it. If you IMPORT the file to Logic all tempo information will be lost.

Some general tips & tricks for Finale/VSL can be found here

http://community.vsl.co.at/forums/t/24478.aspx