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1.Hardware considerations 6/9/2020 10:54:09 AM

Just to follow up: LuCsa seems to be correct here. I overclocked and although my speed went up, I noticed that the main thing that made a difference was the RAM frequency speed. It was set to a lower value than what the RAM modules were advertised as. So I chose XMP 1 from the BIOS setup and now my frequency is 3000Mhz, as it should be, instead of 2133Mhz.

This seems to have lightened the load on my CPU. Instead of hitting 90% on dense/tutti passages in playback, it is hovering around the 75% mark with no drop-outs/crackles etc with 256 buffer sample size at 6-7ms latency.

I'm happy :)

2.Hardware considerations 6/8/2020 7:18:51 PM

Originally Posted by: LuCsa

If all you do is work with VST you will see no benefit whatsoever when overclocking your processor.

Apologies for replying to an old thread but I'm not sure I agree with that. I just went from 3.6Ghz to 4.72Ghz by overclocking and the playback of a large orchestral score using Synchronized Special Editions within VEPro 7 + MIR plugins etc now playback without any pops/crackles with 256 Buffer. It was stuttering before the overclock. I also adjusted the BIOS to reflect the 3000Mhz, as it was showing 2133Mhz for some reason, having installed the Corsair RAM modules with DDR4 3000Mhz.

Do you think it's the RAM speed making the difference? The CPU usage percentage went down after the overclock. Not loads, but noticeable. Unless the RAM tweak is lightening the CPU load?

3.Drive "Rescan Speed" in Synchron Player 5/20/2020 4:59:16 PM

Hi Jason,

That's good to know, glad you shared that information as I am learning about computer builds having recently entered the world of building a PC as my VE Pro server computer.

Originally Posted by: Jason T. Shannon

This is an old thread, but I just thought I'd follow up since the issue is solved. In my case, the slow "Rescan Speed" was caused by generally poor performance from an onboard Marvell SATA controller. I've done alot of testing on about 3 different motherboards, and found that I get much better performance with Intel SATA/RAID controllers. In many cases, I'm seeing better performance out of Intel SATA II controllers than Marvell SATA III controllers. So, the lesson here is to test your controller! They aren't all created equal and some of them are really poor performers that won't take advantage of your SSD.

In the Synchron Player, this was leading to samples being cut short during performance because the SATA controller wasn't able to keep up with the demand. The samples were stored on a Pro Series Samsung SSD, but it didn't matter because the controller was awful!

4.Has anybody tried recent MacBook Pro for VSL (and Cubase, and Dorico)? 5/20/2020 9:57:41 AM

Hi Benjamin,

I have recently used a MBP 16" Master with iMac Slave/Server. I will tell you the positives before the negatives which lead me to return the MBP and sell my iMac...

It's really easy to set up a MBP with the iMac via both Ethernet or Thunderbolt 3. It's really easy to get set up with VE Pro, Cubase and my main software, Sibelius. (Mostly) no need for moving files so that they are ready to use as plugins with DAWs, it all seems to work straight away.

The screens are great and the tech feels and looks stylish. The 16" MBP screen is nice for Cubase. A tiny bit of added screen space is a good thing. However, I nearly always foudn myself connecting my Master to an external monitor. Better for scoring in Sibelius and productivity.

Negatives...

Every time Apple decide to release updates there's a risk of issues with any of your non-Apple-made software. Cubase, Sibelius, VE Pro, VM1 etc. Because they need to do updates to their software to ensure it works smothly with major (and sometimes minor) updates that seem to appear suddenly from Apple. That is frustrating and renders some Apps unsuable/unstable a few times per year. Maybe not for long, but it's still a frustration.

I know you don't mention Sibelius, but in recent months I never had a session whereby it didn't crash. Constantly. Wasting time and energy. For some reason devices wouldn't show up or would in the Sibelius Playback configs, depending on...who knows what? Apple staff, music tech staff at my university or beyond, had no idea why as we were following instructions and recommendations. The university have all Apple iMacs in the studios, but these are not recent machines and it may be that older models were more stable.

I've wasted around £2000 in the last 3 or 4 years as a Mac user. Because when projects get larger or new demanding software/libraries etc are released, you'll find that you'd love to be able to slot more RAM in your MBP or upgrade your CPU in your iMac. None of these options are available for consumers (yes you can upgrade the CPU in a recent iMac but you need to get a professional to do it as you could break the screen or even electrocute yourself). So I ended up re-selling MacBook Pros. Because I made the mistake of thinking I would be fine with a slightly limited machine or trade-offs (e.g. going for a higher CPU and small SSD drive - then regretting getting the small drive). If you're willing to pay a huge amount of money for top spec Mac and be willing to put up with instability or frustration by updates or mystery errors, then you will be ok for using your hardware for a reasonable amount of time before needing to upgrade. Apparently Apple are spending more resources on their iPhones and iPads than computers (speculation perhaps, but I think they've also disbanded a team that was specifically dedicated to computer lines).

The better keyboard on MBP 16 is true, but I found the issues in the previous MBPs to be exaggerated by YouTubers or the general public. I never had problems with the MBP 13" or 15" 2018 models and only found the keybaord to be slightly better to feel and use on the new MBP 16.

The Thunderbolt 3 feature is often mentioned as a reason for Mac, but I found absolutely no benefit in using it over Ethernet Master Server set up. Maybe I was doing something wrong. But I don't think so.

The screens on Macs are praised, but I am now using a Dell XPS with OLED 4K resolution, so if I need to do music to synch with film, it's better to view on this machine and I don't think it's a reason to go for Mac products. Technology outside of Apple has suprised me. There are some really cool non-Apple products out there and I've been in a sort of Apple bubble, not seeing what else is around.

I understand about not wanting to go back to Windows, having got used to the Mac world, as I was the same after only 3 years. But I am so happy that I decided to do it. Windows is NOT as bad as Mac users sometimes say. Yes, there are some intitial frustrations and it takes longer to set up (with moving files to be found within DAW to use as plugins etc) and you need to set up the Ethernet network manually. But this is done once. And remains in place. No major OS updates or otherwise, to throw the setup into instability or waiting for developers to apply fixes etc to Apple updates. I'm actually enjoying Windows and the experience. It's more customise-able.

I just realised I haven't really mentioned the costs. Maybe because it is so obvious. With roughly the price of a MBP i9/64GB RAM/1TB SSD I have built a PC from a gaming motherboard kit (ROG Strix) which is an i9 with 64GB (can install 128GB if I need) and 5TB SSD with room for more; AND I got a Dell XPS and installed 64GB very easily and can easily upgrade the 1TB SSD NVMe it comes with to 2TB with Samsung 970 Pro SSD which is faster than the MBP's SSD, unless I'm mistaken. I am good with hunting for deals but both machines were roughly around the same price as a MBP 16 spec as you mention.

Not a negative, but wanted to mention that I didn't find the MBP getting any hotter than the Dell XPS I am using. Both do get quite hot when used intensively.

Also, it's not worth getting a MBP for the added inch with a 16" if you are scoring for large orchestra. Might be fine for small ensembles though.

What did you decide in the end?

I am sure many will counter my arguements but this is just my own experience from a former Apple Fan-Boy :-)

Originally Posted by: Bela75002

Hi everyone,

I’m about buying a new laptop as, because of the virus situation, I won’t be home near my main computer (an iMac) for a good while and I need to work on a few projects (the only computer I took with me is a MBP end of 2013, only 8 Go of RAM).

Knowing for the last 10 years I have been used to Mac and don’t see myself going back to PC world, despite all the good reasons for it (mainly the price)-besides I wouldn’t know what to choose, and I can not go in shops to ask as they are closed, etc.

When I look on the Internet, they are many warnings regarding recent Mac products. It goes from problem of heating (and of keyboard) on the MacBook Pro 15’’, which was released middle of last year or so, to the T2 chipset which is on Mac computer since 2018 if I’m right and would cause issues in audio, not to mention a security upgrade which seems to have made one of the Thunderbolt ports unusable, and not to mention also many report of issues with Catalina and the e-licenser.

I really don't know if these reports are representative of a majority of users, or only exceptions.

I wanted to know if some of you guys have tried the last MacBook Pro 16’’. It seems better than the 15’’ (better keyboard, heating issue seemingly fixed), but remains the fact it is Thunderbolt I/O only, that the T2 chipset is still in it, and the Catalina system (apparently impossible to downgrade to another OS).

The machine I may buy is the MBP 16’’ with Intel Core i9, 8 cores @ 2,4 GHz, 64 Go RAM, AMD Raderon Pro 5500 M (8 Go Ram), SSD 1 To. It is very expensive, but for once I would have the budget for it.

So my questions are:

Have you experiences any problems with this machine or an equivalent (A Mac created after the introduction of the T2 with 8 cores and Catalina OS) with Cubase, Dorico, or 3rd party plug-ins (I use VSL and Kontakt products)?

How have you managed with the Thunderbolt I/O? Which kind of adaptators or hubs to USB work (for the elicenser, the soundcard - mine is a RME Fireface, the midi keyboard, etc.)? Would you recommend some products, some brands?

Once connected, was there any issue with the elicenser?

Once I'll be back home, could I use this MacBook as a slave to my iMac and run on it the Vienna Ensemble Pro? I know at some point I might have to come to this Master/Slave setup...

Or do you really advise me not to make this choice (but, with confinement etc., I don’t know where I could easily get a product I more or less know to be delivered in my temporary home).

Hope some of you can help,

Thanks,

Benjamin

5.Sibelius harder than Cubase for Server PC 5/20/2020 8:58:13 AM

Hi, my desktop PC (i9-9900K; 64GB RAM) has trouble when scores are very thick/dense in Sibelius but is fine playing the exact same passages in Cubase.

In Sibelius, CPU hits around 80-90% with about 15-18 Synchronized Special Editions instruments playing together/tutti, with MIR Pro, EQ, Compressor on each. RAM used is not much, around 12GB. I've set Synchron Player to load more in the RAM and set threads to max 16 for Synchron Player and VE Pro 7.

1024 Buffer which is more than what I'd prefer.

With the exact same passages played in Cubase it has no trouble. Hitting around 40-60%.

Why is it fine in Cubase but struggling in Sibelius?

I use a master computer to work within Sibelius and Cubase (i7-9750H; 64GB RAM) which uses about 7-12% CPU and very little RAM.

Connected with Ethernet.

6.VEP7 & RAM 4/30/2020 6:32:14 PM

Hi, I'm surprised that your main system is straining with 128GB RAM. I'm very interested to know what solution you find.

On its own, my i9 with 64GB handles around 25-30 Synchron Special Editions instruments playing back together, with peaks around 80% CPU usage at extremely dense/tutti passages. As a server to the master, those same passages are down to around 40-60%.

I wonder if it will be a lot more with adding NI/other sample library instruments running in Kontakt via VE Pro will add a lot more strain. Perhaps.

7.HDD 7200 RPM For applications ok? 4/30/2020 6:22:39 PM

Quick update: I tried this today and had no issues with using the Boot Camp iMac as the master, runing Sibelius on it's 7200RPM HDD. Playing back around 20-25 instruments in tutti passages with latency of around 7ms was certainly ok for me! :) CPU usage was low as well as RAM percentage. Will post more details at some point. VE Pro 7 server system hitting around CPU 40-60% and RAM pretty low usage too around those thickly orchestrated bars.

[EDIT] I thought I should add that I am running each instrument with compressors, EQ and MIR Pro, so that must add to the workload of the systems too. Load times of Sibelius is very quick despite the 7200 HDD. I will upgrade it to SSD in the future but it doesn't seem worth the hassle at the moment.

8.HDD 7200 RPM For applications ok? 4/30/2020 9:15:59 AM

Hi, are there performance issues with running Sibelius or Cubase/any applications from a mechanical 7200 RPM drive, even with having a separate slave/server computer running VEP & samples?

Thinking of making my 27 inch iMac the master (i5-8500; 32GB RAM) but running Windows in Boot Camp as I now prefer Windows and use that on my other machines. However, it's got a Fusion Drive, which means that Apple have built-in their OS to run off the tiny SDD portion and lumps Windows on the slow mechanical based HDD. That HDD runs at just 170 mb/s.

My server/slave machine is self-built: i9-9900K; 64GB RAM; SDD (SATA) 550 mb/s (although I will upgrade that to a NVme 3000 mb/s at some point). Running VE Pro 7; MIR Pro; mainly Synchron-ized Special Editions.

9.T2 Mac issues 4/26/2020 8:37:52 PM

Hi Lupine,

Yes. I had a MBP 15 2018, i7 8th Gen, 32GB RAM. Lovely machine. But...I sometimes got clicks and pops too, with using around 25 - 35 Special Editions instruments (not the Synchron player new Special Editions) and some other libraries together, such as LASS Lite. So not too heavy for it. But still, some issues. I had to up the buffer as 128/256 weren't always stable and still gave me good low latency times.

I would have thought it would have been able to handle all that without any issues at all. To be fair, it did most of the time. But I never felt I got my value for what I paid for it. I since learnt from others here and in general, that laptops aren't great at managing heavier orchestral workloads, even high spec ones. After 3 years of Apple, I realised that I'm paying over the top for an equivalent PC/Windows system and have always been more comfortable with Windows (conversly to most I'd expect).

Anyway, laptops just don't seem powerful enough in comparison to desktop builds unfortunately. So I've just finished building my first PC from using a i9 CPU pre-installed gaming motherbord, adding my own RAM and SSD parts. It works much better. I may get a laptop to use away from the desk or to share the load as I have 2 VEP 7 licenses or even within a master/slave setup. The next laptop it will be one where I can install more RAM and SSD storage in myself later on. Not a MacBook basically.

I did hear about the T2 chip causing issues. I can't remember what it was though. Are there specific T2 chip issues going on with music software?

10.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 4/24/2020 11:58:57 AM

Originally Posted by: RCMusic23

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

If you are not an Apple's fan boy, may be go for a well-built pc with individual graphic card, you can have a much more power machine at a reasonable price and enjoy your 4K screen with large templates.

....So I sold the MBP and am looking to sell my iMac and I am no longer an Apple fan boy. For various reasons. Anyway, I've built myself a gaming PC (although not using it for games at the moment and will install a nice GPU later). Do I even need a master if my custom built desktop works well?

CPU: i9-9900K (16 Threads)

RAM: 64GB at 3000mhz

At the moment, I have to adjust the buffer to around 256 samples and around 10ms latency for large scores in Sibelius Ultimate edition. I had thought it would manage 128 at lower latency. I am sure I could tweak things to get the sample rate/latency down.

I am looking at ordering a Dell XPS 7950 CPU: i7-9750H (12 Threads), I will install 64GB RAM and comes with a 1TB SSD. I get a nice student discount added to the promo offer taking it to around minus £300+ however, as a self-funded PhD student, I still don't want to pay more than I need.

Are there any composers out there using just 1 machine? What specs?

Thanks.

UPDATE: I went ahead in ordering the XPS as I would like to work on scores away from the desk at times and it might be possible to use it as a master perhaps? Even if it is a laptop. Otherwise, I can always send it back and perhaps get a cheaper laptop for just sketching ideas and having a portable system but not for use in any VEP set up and use just one machine.

11.Latest Synchron player short notes dropping? 4/11/2020 8:05:55 AM

Was there a solution to this?

I'm having the same problems in both Cubase and Sibelius.

Is increasing the buffer the only solution? I've tried raising the Default Preload Size to 8192 but it still happens.

If you Google "Cutting Off or Not Sounding VSL Synchron Samples" someone found a solution by decreasing their buffer within Cubase, which sounds odd. I will try that. I could understand the increasing aspect, but maybe the decreasing has something to do with working at the best settings for Syncrhon?

Thanks.

iMac 64GB, i5 6-Core, SSD

MacBook Pro 16GB, i9 8-Core, SSD

12.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 12/1/2019 4:27:21 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Don't need to move your OS and DAW to external drive, the fusion drive can handle these software very well.

Turns out I was mistaken. The quick boot up was actually from my Fusion Drive, not the external Samsung X5 so I returned it. The Fusion drive is quicker to boot up the system than an SSD NVme drive connected with USB-C (since connecting with Thunderbolt isn't possible without spending a lot of money on an imported Gen 3 enclosure). The X5 was basically an NVme in a dedicated Gen3 / 40gbps Thunderbolt 3 drive and cable. Great performance, but not what I needed, as you are right, the Fusion Drive handles these well.

The Fusion Drive in my iMac is 7200rmp and since the OS puts the regularly used apps etc on the tiny SSD portion, it is fine. I only ever have about 18GB of apps anyway.

13.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 11/4/2019 10:06:29 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Don't need to move your OS and DAW to external drive, the fusion drive can handle these software very well.

Besides, RAID is not safe for data storage, once one of the drives goes down, the whole system may crash and you will lose your data , so never put your OS/projet files/important personal data in RAID.

Check out the 4k iops read speed on testing software. That's the most important rating you should care about SSD for music production. RAID won't help improving this performance. Anyway, it's useful to have large SSD drives for all samples.

I returned the two ssds used in a RAID. I agree, it's not stable nor a good option.

I bought the external SSD Samsung X5 which is comparable to Apple's internal SSDs and much faster than the Fusion Drive. I did put the system and apps there as well as my samples. I'm using the 1TB internal Fusion Drive as my documents/project files etc.. Now my iMac is running quicker and no dropouts/latency/pops/crackles etc. Just smooth functioning and I like it :)

Thanks for your advice.

14.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 11/3/2019 3:42:46 PM

...maybe not the last thing my friend haha!

That was really helpful about explaining the Fusion Drive misrepresentation. Thanks.

Question: Will moving Sibelius, Cubase, Logic to new Application Folder on an external MNve SSD make those programmes run faster? I know certain system apps can't be moved, but those applications can.

I will put all Sample Libraries on an external MVme for sure. I don't see the need anymore, to separate music DAWs/programs from the Sample Library folder on SSD/Flash, but I could see the need in the old days with machanical HDDs due to having to read whilst the other write, no? But if it's ok with SSDs to have programmes and samples on the same drive, and if it improves the programme running speed etc, then I'd move those programmes to the SSDs too...

So, I've bought 2 x 1 TB Crucial MVme SSDs for a great price (couldn't find a singular 2 TB module). Since I can't install them myself on the motherboard (I'm not experienced and it's a 50 step process or something!). Each SSD is capable of 2000Mbs individually, using a Thunderbolt 3 cable and correct enclosure. I've put them in 10Gbps enclosures only for now (I couldn't find 20 or 40Gbps enclosures very easily and they're really expensive from what I've seen).

Connected via USB-C (I don't have a Thunderbolt 3 cable at the moment) the spead of each SSD is around 800-950Mbs from Blackmagic readings. I've made them into a RAID 0. Now its speed is around 1600-1750Mbs as a combined volume.

When I find a couple of enclosures capable of higer than 10Gbps and connect with the 40Gbs Apple/or Belkin cables, would that RAID shoot up to around 4000Mbs then?

Anyway, having samples on this 1750Mbs will surely help. I know RAID aren't as reliable as a single SSDs. I tried installing Mac OS on this RAID but Apple don't allow it, so it didn't work. Probably a good thing, as if one of the SSDs fail the whole RAID and therefore, OS is broken.

I do back everything up on a 3Tb LaCie Time Machine drive and Google Drive, so even if this RAID dies, there'll be backups.

15.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 11/1/2019 8:05:41 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Originally Posted by: RCMusic23

However, rather than returning thie iMac and ordering a higher CPU spec, instead would it be better to spend this £400 - £800 higher cost on a really fast, large NVme SSD and using that to run my OS and storing my sample libraries? Stick with the i5 8th Gen I mean. Some say there's no real difference between the i5 8th Gen and 9th Gen.

Hardrive with OS can't be replaced. But you can store your samples on Nvme streaming from thunderbolt 3 to improve performance. So yes, it will help a lot.

9th gen only has 5%-9% better performance than 8th gen, the price seems not to be worth.

Using third party usb hub also affects performance. You plug both your external sata SSD and Audio interface and other midi controller in the usb hub with MBP, which often creats noise and pops on streaming. That's the reason why I suggest to use desktop computers, like iMacs they have multiple native thunderbolt3 and Usb3 connectors.

So I found out some things. The OS can be run on an external SSD and programmes run from it too. But there doesn't seem too much point. The read of the Fusion Drive is around 2500 Mb/s so pretty fast.

I spent an hour or more even with an Apple tech guy at the store. He suggested that there was no real benefit for my music composing and production in returning my iMac for a higher CPU spec. In fact the iMac I have with the 8th Gen i5 has a better benchmark than the i7 7th Gen 2018 MacBook Pro I am replacing. We tested out a few things with the iMacs and even a Mac Pro there (not MacBook Pro, but MacPro the thing that costs upwards of £4000!

The real benefit for music production and VEP VSL etc seems in the SSD and RAM, and the i5 is good enough. This is along the lines you say too.

So in the end, I get both objectives complete: better and bigger screen, a good iMac with a tonne of RAM and the possibility to get a computer repair shop or similar to put in a future i9 and/or replace the Fusion with an internal SSD (which can be done from reading others who have done this).

But for now, a happy iMac and I will look for a SSD of the NVme type for my sample libraries :)

16.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 11/1/2019 1:54:41 PM

So the pops and clicks were due to using my iPad Pro as a second screen, to control the VEP (not through VM1 but just extending the VEP mixing desk to the iPad). I also noticed that performance suffers at times when using the screen of the MacBook Pro at Default resolution, but is much better at scaled down to the next level down. Navigating the scores in Sibelius is smoother too.

However, now I have the iMac 2019 27" with 72GB but an i5 8th Gen processor. It would be too hard for me to install an i9 8th or 9th Gen, as it's an expert's job. You can order the higher spec CPU from Apple's site and they custom make it and send it.

17.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 10/30/2019 6:14:28 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Quote:

I am also a pianist and will record an album of piano music, to be commercial distributed worldwide but if I were to split the costs with my record company for recordings by another artists, that would push into the same price as a iMac 2019! So I want to record them myself this time. So yes, will be using for recording too.

Ok, That's the reason you care about 32 buffer size, you really need that low latency.

Quote:

I've spent the whole day weighing up my options. It really does look like a 2019 iMac 27" base model with me adding the RAM and further along the line getting an i7 or i9 processer to switch out the i5 6-Core base model one.

Luckily I received some nice royalties this quarter. All that will be going to such an iMac, I've decided. First I will add more RAM so with 4 slots (I think two taken by the 8GB) I will get 64GB of RAM and install that, taking it up to 72GB.

Next year I will add an i9 to it.

Some points you need to pay attention before buying:

1. Make sure to get a set of RAM kits at the same Mhz as the originals. EX: your new iMac has 2X4GB Ram at 2666MHz, you'd better find one set of 2X32GB at 3000MHz to add, avoiding any compatibility issus.

RAMs may have compatibilty conflits even though they look familiar in tech description, so buy the kits instead of single ones. Kits are made with same DIE and tested by manufacturerers to make sure they work fine together.

2. Common RAM size is the mutiple of 2, such as 16,32,64,128 etc. 72 is a really rare size since computer nowaday funtion with dual rack of ram or single rack. Triple rack RAM can only be found ten years ago.

3.For most music production, desktop i7 8th generation is way too powerful. If you won't have some huge amouts of track to do mastering/mixing job, don't over commit to a top monster CPU, is a waste of money.

4.64GB is enough for most situation, check out how many projet you may reach the limit, don't invest on another 64GB that you will never use.

5. The speed of SSD should be taken as a foctor that affects your work flow. While using VST and huge samples in composing (VSL, Eastwest, Spitfire...etc), what matters is the 4K ramdom read speed. Computer loads part of your samples in the RAM, and search the rest in your SSD when receiving signals from your midi equitment(you play your master keyboard and creat some signals, they are "ramdom" to your computer). That's how modern sample players with "DFD"(direct from disk) work.

Nvme SSDs are the best choice for large orchestral VST arrangement. Apple's iMac has small harddrive in their basic models, and they charge plenty for hundreds of GB, so thinking of buying a Nvme SSD and a thounderbolt 3 external harddrive enclosure to store your samples.

Sata SSDs are cheaper but with less 4K ramdom read speed.

This factor may cause the crakles/drop out issus at low latency. Simply 'cause your SSD is not fast engouh to catch up with the CPU and RAM! Woodern barrel theory. Try to balance your budget on SSD, it will improve the whole system's performance in music prodution.

"i9 9th gen, 128RAM, Sata SSD" may result in much poor performance than "i7 9th gen ,64RAM, Nvme SSD".

Looking forward to listen to some of your composition and learn someting new :)

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Oh. I didn't know I could put 3000Mhz in there. I already got this from Amazon: Dataram DDR4 2666Mhz So-Dimm Compatible With The 2019 iMac 27" 5K 64GB.

Was so easy to fit in :) I hope it will be ok? Or would it be a lot different if I had put 3000Mhz instead?

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

The iMac has 4 slots/racks available. There are 2 x 4GB already in there. I just added 2 x 32GB in the two spare slots. This is the 72GB total. Will there be performance issues by mixing GB (4GBs modules sitting along side the 32GBs)? Should they be all even, like 32 + 32 +32 +32? I spent £300 on the 64GB (2 x 32GB) but don't have enough funds to stretch to another 2 x 32GB just yet.

Also, do they all have to be of the same Mhz? Or can my 2 x 32GB 2666Mhz work with a future set of 3000Mhz?

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

"i9 9th gen, 128RAM, Sata SSD" may result in much poor performance than "i7 9th gen ,64RAM, Nvme SSD".

About the processor. It's only got an i5 6-Core 8th Gen. It seems too difficult for me to upgrade that myself anyway. Something to do with removing the screen. If that happens, I'd have to trust an actual technician to do it or perhaps ask if an Apple technition might, but I doubt they would. So the i5 is ok for now then?

Storage: I was using the internal SSD of the MacBook Pro for VSL. Literally, had hardly any applications of files on my system, just all VSL ahah! I have already bought a WD Blue NAND SSD M.2 SATA 1TB and put in an encloser. It's around 400 MB/S which is waaay slower than the MacBook Pro's 1500 MB/S Write & 2500 MB/S Read speed (read is the important bit for samples, right?)

The new iMac seems to be around 2500MB/S too, but I only have 1TB of that. So Maybe it would make sense to keep my sample libraries in the NAND SSD connected with Thunderbolt 3?

NVme and the other 64GB would be a nice upgrade for next year. I'll keep my eye out for NVme SSD though.

Thanks again for all this information! Very helpful.

Thanks re: new music! Send me a private DM and I'll send you my website etc if you are interested.

I'm also a new-ish part-time music PhD student so composing is a bit slow due to having to get through lots of publications/books etc. But in 2020 will have new stuff out! :)

18.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 10/29/2019 9:49:50 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Do you have some recording projets? You only use sebelius for composing or you will play a midi keyboard in DAW in realtime?

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

Or else you have to invest in a much powerful machine.

Next year I will add an i9 to it.

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

ometimes we've got to do what we have to, I've paid enough to figure out how this works. I was supposed to be simply a composer but not a hardware/computer DIY expert or something.

I agree, sometimes you have to do what you need to, and sometimes it's a learning experience that costs a lot of money I guess. I want a machine that will be future proof to as much as it can be, without paying the cost of a car!

I'm selling some equipment as well, to finance this. I think it makes sense to sell my MacBook Pro too, since you suggest that it will not be good as a Master, outputting on to a 4K screen of an iMac Slave? My MacBook can use the iMac's display via Thunderbolt 3 connection, but you mentioned about the MacBook Pro's CPU wiould be dedicating a lot of CPU to manage this.

So, looking at the peak, I will have a 128GB i9 iMac by next year. At the moment it will be an 72GB i5 (but 6 Cores, so not a dull i5). It is not worth keeping the MacBook Pro (32GB, i7 6-Cores) as a Master? I have a 2018 iPad Pro 12.9" and that works great as a non-music-tasks-laptop following OS updates that allow a mouse to be used with it etc. So I wouldn't need to have the MacBook Pro to do those tasks anymore.

19.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 10/29/2019 12:50:27 PM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

In your case, the problem for laptop is they don't have indiviual graphic card to support 2k/4k, which means it will eat up quite a lot of CPU power. You need every single CPU capacity to deal with audio and VST.

Further more, streaming via gigabit cable, the laptop will produce crakles/pops when huge data flows in/out, which forces you to raise your buffer size and ends up with higher latency. Bottom line, laptops (Macbook pro) are not that good as both master or slave for large orchestral VST composing. I have an old macbook pro 2013 myself, I've tried and without luck. Disappoiting!

Otherwise , choose a i9 iMac 2018 and upgrade the ram to 32G yourself. Use cheaper PC with core graphic card as slave to provide CPU power via VEP if it's still not enough.

Hope this help, enjoy composing!

Yes, you've been a great help. Especially regarding the graphics output factor. I wish I'd asked you before I bought my MBP.

Yeah, I'm an Apple Fanboy lol! I love the accessibility features they have built-in which helps for my medical conditions, plus I enjoy the experience of using them.

I'm really regretting getting my MBP last year as well I've just learnt about the current 2019 iMac 27" being capable of being manually upgraded to 128GB. Even though the base model is i5, that apparently can be upgraded to i9 (although it's not clear if this will cause heat issues).

If I sell my MBP I'd only get abour £1000 for it having paid £2500. Big loss of £1500, for only 15 months of usage. Then to get the base model 2019 iMac 27 (I've 10% discount) is around £1500 and upgrading to 64GB an extra £300 or so I think.

I don't know what to do, as I'm needing to compose more and more large-epic scale music for tv and film etc. My 15" screen is ok, but starts to get tiny with huge numbers of instrumnts and a bigger screen would allow me to see more bars ahead.

Currently, on my 32GB MBP, I've got around 12GB spare when using full symphonic playback in Sibelius. That's with 6 input events/instances covering winds, brass, strings, percussion. 48000khz Buffer 32, latency around 4ms.

20.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 10/28/2019 10:05:03 AM

Originally Posted by: mohsohsenshi

It's not worth investing in an used Mac if your current machine works fine. No dropouts/crakles = No need for a new computer. Once your Macbook pro run out of resources with your orchestral templates, it won't help much even if with VEP, because the performance depends on your slave. Laptop is not a ideal slave machine. And older iMac has less CPU power than your 2018 MBP.

Thanks.

Current MBP produces pops/crakles when I drop the sample rate to achieve less than 5ms latency. It also struggles at higher setting to allow more latency when using it's native Retina display as oppsed to the monitor output. I imagine the Retina display is more demanding on the resources.

So, if I opt for a 2k / 4k monitor I presume the MBP would struggle with lowest latency settings.

Yep, I agree about laptops not being best suited as slaves. I bought it months before I discovered the networking potential of running VEP across multiple machines to share the load. So am stuck with it. It's a fine machine, no doubt, but as my scores are becoming more complex, I was wondering if it might work fine as a slave to an older Mac master running just the Sibelius/Cubase software.

21.New monitor. Buy a used iMac as Master instead? Hmm... 10/27/2019 12:18:09 PM

Hi! So, I have a MacBook Pro 2018 (32GB Ram; i7 8th Gen, 6 Cores). Use it with an external monitor (24 inch Benq GL2450), using Sibelius Ultimate, composing with large orchestral templates.

The monitor may need replacing soon. I was looking for monitors between £250 - £350.

As Apple don't make standalone retina displays, if I want a nice 4K or 2K screen, I'd need to buy a refurb/renewed iMac to use the monitor! That would be around £500 - £850 for at least 8GB Ram and either i5 or i7. So maybe I could use it as a Master and the MBP as a slave? I am considering a 27inch iMac model so that I can upgrade the Ram to 16-32GB at some point too.

I currently get around 4-6ms latency. I would like a lower latency for when I am playing the piano using 8DIO's 1928 Steinway, but not essential, as if I'm composing for piano, it will be a much smaller template of a couple of instruments or just the piano on it's own.

Would I see any performance improvement in orcehstral templates by using such an iMac as a Master and my MBP as a slave, for this template using VEP 7 in Sibelius and occassionally Cubase:

Piccolo. Fl. Ob. Cl. Bsn. Hn. Tpt. Tbn (Tenor & Bass). Tba. Timp. Cym. Perc (Xyl. Vibra. Marimba. Drums etc) Hrp. Vl.1 Vl.2 Vla. Vc. Cb. PLUS some cinematic plugins from Native Instruments and 8DIO.

My audio interface is PreSonus AudioBox iTwo. I don't use microphones and occassionally just use my electric guitar, so I don't need a fancy interface.

Any advice appreciated. :)

22.Synchron Player OSX 2/21/2019 1:46:59 PM

Thank you so much! I spent 2 hours trying to figure this out!

I checked the manual and didn't see any indication that it was to be loaded via Vienna Ensemble. Unless I missed i?

I agree, it needs to be a lot clearer.

23.Sibelius Sound Set for Epic Orchestra 9/26/2018 4:49:43 PM

Hi Andi,

When I installed the SoundSet it seems like it's for Special Editions only and not a separate one for Epic Orchestra? On VE Pro 6, there is no listing of Epic Orchestra under the Sibelius tree. Does that mean that we just load the Preset files instead, when using Sibelius?

Many thanks,

Ricky.

24.VE Pro 6 Crashing 8/28/2018 2:38:56 PM

Thanks for confirming that. I found the solution for my issue, and will mention it here, in case anyone has similar problems.

It was because I selected the 32 bit version of Vienna Ensemble Pro Server (as that was the one that appeared in my Mac dock), but went to the containing folder to find the 64 bit version icon, clicked on it and have no problems now. I put the 64 bit version on my dock, for easy access. Thanks to Paul Kopf at VSL Team for the suggestion and help.

25.VE Pro 6 Crashing 8/25/2018 2:36:33 PM

Well, actually it might be of help, as it might suggest that the issue is related to using a Mac, if you are no longer having issues with Windows, using VE Pro 6. :)

I just thought they might have come back to you? But perhaps you told them not to look in to it further?

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