bump!

Many thanks for comments. The bit about the last chord is interesting, I've played with the timing a bit already, it always sounds a bit snatched or else the rhythm comes unstuck, I probably need to tone down the volume of the end of the crescendo.

Reverb-wise, when funds permit I'll upgrade my mobo which will allow more than 2 Altiverb instances, setting that thing up is an art in itself. For reference I had a listen to a favourite orchestral CD (Rite of Spring / Kirov Orch / Gergiev on Philips) through my studio monitors and was surprised how little reverb there is, and how much key rattle, chair scrapes etc. Even the famous high bassoon opening is quite up front.

Thanks, Goran. I used HSO for violin II, flute II, clarinet II, oboe II and bassoon II. Also I use its spiccato double basses (though not on this track) for added scrape, the App ones are a bit slow.  I'm thinking it might be better to make bassoon II the VSL one as it's the lowest and in some ways most critical. For non-legato articulations I've sometimes doubled up on the VSL 'first' instrument instead.

Finished this one recently, I think it's getting there, but funny how you lose the ability to be objective about a mix after listening for days! Any comments welcome.

https://soundcloud.com/vyvhopescott/flying

Appassionata strings, various VSL woodwind and brass, also project SAM brass and quite a few Steinberg Halion Symphony instruments as second woodwinds etc.

Many thanks for this Paul. I think what has been happening is that when I've switched between sequencer projects, the song files have been using their own 'old' versions of matrices, so I've had to make the edits again in the new song.

The moral appears to be to spend a lot of time getting the template right before using it on a real piece of music, otherwise you get loads of conflicting versions.

Cheers,

Hi,

Could someone please clarify the hierarchy among the various files (presets / matrices / patches / song file / VEP project / VEP meta)? I thought I had it figured out but now I'm not sure, I seem to have to keep making the same changes over and over.

If I load a factory preset I understand  I can save it (renamed) as a user preset. But if I change (say) the order of a couple of patches in a matrix, do I have to save/rename the matrix AND the preset as separate file operations? If I change the slot x-fade settings or whether Velocity x_fade is on or off, is that saved as part of the matrix or part of the preset, or both?

And what about the song (project) file in my sequencer? Am I right in thinking that it also saves all changes to matrices and presets (though without altering the names of anything, which is confusing?

Finally, what about VE Pro files, the project and meta- files: do they include any edits to the matrices and presets within them?

Sorry if this is a rather basic question, but I have an ever-increasing load of nearly identical files and it's getting more and more bewildering. Thanks in advance

Hi,

A problem that is stopping me use VE pro as much as I'd like is that when I highlight the VE window, Cubase loses focus so the keyboard stops responding. This doesn't happen when I just use multiple VI instances as VST's, since it's all happening within the DAW. But with VE Pro, even mouse clicking on the visual keyboard in each VI instance doesn't work, the only way I can hear sound is to run the sequence.

Have I missed a vital config step somewhere?

Couldn't agree more, dragonfly. To be fair to VSL though, the point is that every matrix needs its own expressionmap, so what you want is a tool for rapidly creating em's from a given matrix. (Cf. Cubase's automatic import Keyswitch option which only works with VST3s)

I'm coming round to the view that it's better to start with a really simple matrix and only add the extra fancy articulations when needed (and update the expressionmap for the piece you're working on). This begs the question 'why have I spent all this money on extra articulations when I only use a handful of them?' But you don't want an em with so many keyswitch options that it takes up most of the screen when editing a part.

Quite so. If you're just deciding which version to get, get Pro. But once you've got Home, it's bizarrely expensive to upgrade (last time I looked).

Hi,

I have Win 7 Pro on my DAW machine and Win 7 Home on the slave. You're right that Home doesn't ordinarily allow remote desktop to work, and you'll find it a lot easier if you can use this. Luckily there is a patch/hack here:

http://www.raymond.cc/blog/enable-remote-desktop-connection-in-windows-7-home-premium/

I can't remember now how I set it up but it wasn't a major problem and now I run the brass section of my orchestra off my laptop.

... of course I should have said, Fabio, your situation may be entirely different from mine! The actual chamber string sounds in Strings SE 2 and 2+ are great, just frustratingly short of the full experience.

I have some woodwind instruments as extended library downloads, you get the feeling there that if you can't find the sound you want, it's your fault for not looking hard enough!

The economics of buying the SE sections depends on what other VSL libraries you already have, and if there's any likelihood of you upgrading at a later date.

I already have Appasionata strings Standard and am very happy with it. I bought SE Strings 2 and 2+.for the Chamber strings and thought the App sordino would be a bonus. The problem is, not only do the SE sections contain fewer samples per patch, but the preset structure (eg the way portamento is introduced) is entirely different on the 2 products.The App sordino sounds very synthy to me, partly the nature of the sound and partly because it doesn't include the full performance legato patches.

I rather naively thought that the cost of the SE set would be deducted from a Collections purchase, but this isn't true either, for my €200 outlay I only get €100 discount off the FULL (extended) Chamber Strings collection, nothing off the standard collection. I should have just bought the Standard Chamber Collection to start with.

As the man said - "buy cheap, buy twice!"

I'd be interested to know the answer too. I guess I'm now on the steepest part of the VI learning curve, every time I load up a project I seem to have to start all over again creating expression maps and choosing patches, leaving any vestiges of musical inspiration way behind.

I think there are at least 3 expression parameters you might want to use:

 - Velocity xFade (which I like to map to cc1 because every other library uses cc1 for increased 'intensity'). NB you get phasing artefacts with woodwind solos but it's great with strings;

- I recently stumbled on the idea of using 'slots', most usefully to add staccato artic. in slot B to legato sounds. you increase a cc (cc3 perhaps) to give the sounds more attack. I don't use xfade, just the normal slot control so you get more staccato as you ride the controller

- lastly 'Expression' which as far as I can see is just volume. Can anyone say if it's anything more than volume???

Hello,

A few observations on VSL file behaviour, can anyone confirm I’ve got this right?

Load a preset, eg OB2_VSL_Preset_Level1. Now change one of the matrices (eg swap 2 cells round) and save the preset.  You’ll have to give it a new name as I understand you can’t overwrite the factory presets.

The matrix edit is INCLUDED in your preset file. Even though
it says that the second matrix is still called ‘LB1 OB2 Articulation Combi’ and
highlighted as such in the VI browser window, it’s not the same as the original matrix. You can reload this original matrix back and will lose your edit.

Even more confusingly, if you save the current song in
Cubase, this too includes a snapshot of your preset, (and its constituent matrices), as it was at the moment you saved,  independent of what the VSL preset and matrix files on disk actually contain. For
the record Cubase does the same with expressionmaps and probably everything else.

So if you make incremental improvements to your VSL setup remember
that they will not be recognised by your other projects, until you reload every preset and expressionmap from the file browser.  Obvious to some, perhaps, but it certainly explains why I’ve been getting déjà vu making the same edits over and over. It might be nice if VI included some hint that the version of presets and matrices you have loaded differs from what's on the disk.

If I've got this wrong, could someone please advise!

Hello,

[Apologies if this is a FAQ question, I'm sure it's been dealt with elsewhere but I can't find it]

I upgraded from standard to extended versions of French Oboe and now have 2 sets of files:

.../VSL/07D_oboe_french/oboe_french 01.dat etc(6 files)

.../VSL/07D_oboe_french/36_oboe 2/Oboe-2_Full_01.dat etc (13 files)

Do I need to keep both sets? I'm assuming the 2 is there for VSL's housekeeping purposes, as far as I know I haven't bought a second oboe specifically. In an ideal world I'd like everything in

.../VSL/oboe/xxx.dat

and similar for my other instruments but if I re-organise things like this will all my old projects stop working?

Thanks in advance,

Hello,

On its own I'm not sure it justifies the price (it's basically buying me another 6 Gig of RAM) but The Epic Orchestra is definitely a tempting addition. Can anyone tell me how comprehensive the Fanfare trumpets and Epic Horns selections are (compared to buying them as download instruments)? And would my purchase qualify me for any discount if I later decided to get the corresponding standard libraries? I already have Appassionata Strings and several woodwind instruments.

Thanks in advance,

Vyv

It may also be of interest that the remarks from Colin Young of Allianz that they don't insure software were specifically contradicted when I insured my VSL and Cubase software with them last week. I wrote about it in the SOS forum and phoned Allianz who categorically said my software was covered under their 'PowerPlay' policy. The word 'software' appears in the list of instrument categories on their online form and is printed on my Certificate of Insurance so hopefully they won't be able to wriggle out of it! £25 a year for 2 grand's worth of licenses.

They point out that they don't cover 'data', but I'm reasoning that it's the dongle with the licence on that is the at-risk item.

I still think the whole issue of having to buy new software just because the dongle, which cannot be backed up, has gone missing is extremely fishy, legally and philosophically. [... insert rant here ... ]

A slightly more specific question:

Cubase expression maps are in XML so easily generated with any text-handling language like PHP or C. VSL preset and matrix files however are not readable in a text editor - but is the format in which the data is encoded and stored something that Vienna makes publically available? If so it would be quite easy to write a program that would scan a VSL file, find the keyswitches/controller zones and cell names, and generate a Cubase expression map instantly.

Such a program wouldn't be able to invent "musical" articulation names, but in practice I just want to see the matrix cell name ('sta', 'rPo' etc)  in the Cubase articulation strip so I can assign the right patch to the right note.

Just a suggestion ...

Hi everyone,

I bought into VSL a few months back, now using App Strings 1 and various download wind instruments. Currently working on would-be John Willams Hollywood-style orchestration for a production library project. (Yeah, I know). The VSL sounds are great but I spend a disproportionate amount of time tweaking VSL matrices, and then even longer tweaking the Cubase expression maps to choose the right cell for each note. A few basic questions emerge:

 - Is there any difference, processing-wise, between having several matrices key switched within one preset as against one very large matrix? I get the feeling Cubase stumbles when making fast switches between matrices (requiring 2-3 keyswitch commands in sequence, one to choose the matrix and one or two to specify the cell), but not when switching between cells. This is a problem where eg a legato phrase has frequent staccato or detache notes in it.

- Has anyone come up with a consistent method of producing custom presets so that, as far as possible, the same keyswitches and controllers call up the same musical effect regardless of instrument? Obviously some articulations are specific to intrument families but things like staccato, portato, sfz, fp etc are universal for sustained instruments, as is the need for a single controller that mimics blowing/scraping harder as you advance it

- Or should one just accept the need to make a new set of custom matrices for every arrangement?

- Is there a utility which derives Cubase expressionmap data from VSL matrix files automatically? Having done it by hand a few times I can assure you it is an entirely brain-dead algorithmic process, the sort of thing a computer should do rather easily.

Any thoughts?