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Multitimbral?
Last post Sun, Nov 27 2005 by cwillsher, 27 replies.
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Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 19:51
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
Is the Vienna Instrument multi-timbral?

Does it load more than one instrument per instance or is one instance needed per instrument?

So one VI for Violin, one for Viola, one for Contrabass, one for Cello?

Or I can have all of these in one instance? It doesn't mention anything about multiple channels per instance.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 21:33
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
No info on this?

I can't decipher this from the videos. It looks as if its one Vienna Instrument per instrument.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:13
by cwillsher
Joined on Fri, Mar 04 2005, Southampton, UK, Posts 210
Yep. I would say almost certainly one instrument per instance.

Though presumably you could load matrices for different instruments and switch between them, provided they were only playing one articulation (or sample set) at a time. ie. you could switch between solo flute and solo clarinet patches but not play them simultaneously within the same instance.

Colin
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:15
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
David Ender confirmed that it isn't multi-timbral.

The matrix switching is cool, no doubt, but you can't have multiple instruments playing that way. It just allows you to switch between them via keyswitch or whatever.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:35
by timkiel
Joined on Fri, Jun 06 2003, Posts 627
The lack of multi-timbrality is also interesting in that depending on your VST host you are going to be limited to the number of VSTs you can host - even with nothing loaded.

E.G In CubaseSX3 there is a max of 64 VSTs. This then logically means a max of 64 MIDI tracks (1 per VI instance) so even by using freeze/ram save options you will in SX3 at least not be able to have more than 64 Instruments playing at the same time - might be enough, but I'm not sure....
Intel Mac Pro (2 x 2.66 Xeon Dual Core, 8GB RAM, Nvidia 7300GT), RME Fireface 800, OS 10.6.4, Logic 9.1.1 (64-bit mode)
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:42
by david ender
Joined on Fri, Feb 20 2004, Vienna/Austria, Posts 461
I believe that to play 64 instruments at once you would have to use several computers, anyway - or wait for the 128-bit CPU [Wink]

regards,
d.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:48
by DG
Joined on Wed, May 12 2004, Posts 8608
I can't ever remember haing more than 64 instruments playing at a time, although I have got close. Never on 1 computer though Big Smile

DG
Nuendo 6.03, 4.3
2 x Intel Xeon x5675 3.07GHz Hex Core
48GB RAM
Windows 7 (x64)Pro
RME Multiface II
Intensity
ATI HD5400 series graphics card
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:53
by timkiel
Joined on Fri, Jun 06 2003, Posts 627
I've had 70 running on 1 PC. 5 Instances of HALion each with 16 instruments loaded. Of course I use Freeze and RAMSave but still in effect 70 editable instruments. Whereas the max now is 64 and thats if I choose not to use other VSTs such as Stylus or Atmosphere....
Intel Mac Pro (2 x 2.66 Xeon Dual Core, 8GB RAM, Nvidia 7300GT), RME Fireface 800, OS 10.6.4, Logic 9.1.1 (64-bit mode)
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:54
by DG
Joined on Wed, May 12 2004, Posts 8608
timkiel wrote:
I've had 70 running on 1 PC. 5 Instances of HALion each with 16 instruments loaded. Of course I use Freeze and RAMSave but still in effect 70 editable instruments. Whereas the max now is 64 and thats if I choose not to use other VSTs such as Stylus or Atmosphere....


Obviously not VSL Performance Instruments though Big Smile

DG
Nuendo 6.03, 4.3
2 x Intel Xeon x5675 3.07GHz Hex Core
48GB RAM
Windows 7 (x64)Pro
RME Multiface II
Intensity
ATI HD5400 series graphics card
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 22:56
by timkiel
Joined on Fri, Jun 06 2003, Posts 627
No, perf instruments too - not all of them, Little Ugly has over 64 instruments in it to, if I remember correctly - the MIDI file is around somewhere on this site.
Intel Mac Pro (2 x 2.66 Xeon Dual Core, 8GB RAM, Nvidia 7300GT), RME Fireface 800, OS 10.6.4, Logic 9.1.1 (64-bit mode)
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 23:08
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
You shouldn't need anywhere near 64 instruments since an instrument used to sometimes equal an articulation of an instrument. Now, each instance will represent an instrument in its entirety. I think you could get a valid midi mockup with maybe 32 instances.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 23:08
by Lindurion
Joined on Thu, Feb 19 2004, Pittsburgh, PA, Posts 11
You also have to remember that most of the perf. legato samples loaded are usually not used (every sampled interval from every note, etc.) so this new optimize RAM button should greatly increase the number of perf. instruments that can be feasibly loaded at once!

January seems so far away...

- Lindurion
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 23:12
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
I'll say this...

Depending on how complete you make a track before adding more instruments, the RAM purging feature will be a godsend.

The Kontakt RAM feature is outstanding and this looks just as good if not better.

In Kontakt I had one instrument go from 156 MB of RAM down to 20 or so. This will allow you to load much more into RAM provided your workflow accomodates this process.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 23:21
by david ender
Joined on Fri, Feb 20 2004, Vienna/Austria, Posts 461
RAM purging allows you to continue working on that track within the limits of the samples retained - i.e., you can still change velocity (especially if you're using velocity crossfades), speed etc. as long as the changes don't affect the actual samples played. If you transpose a part, you'll have to reload all the samples, and optimise again.

Have a look at the video tutorials for more info!

regards,
d.
Posted on Sat, Nov 26 2005 23:23
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
I've watched it. And its cool.

The only confusion around the feature on the forum here has to do with the process. It won't do you much good to purge the RAM if you aren't done with a track as you'll just end up having to reload the samples since the notes you may be wanting may have been purged.

Its still an oustanding feature. It just may take some of you a while to get accustomed to it.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 01:21
by DG
Joined on Wed, May 12 2004, Posts 8608
Joseph Burrell wrote:
I've watched it. And its cool.

The only confusion around the feature on the forum here has to do with the process. It won't do you much good to purge the RAM if you aren't done with a track as you'll just end up having to reload the samples since the notes you may be wanting may have been purged.

Its still an oustanding feature. It just may take some of you a while to get accustomed to it.


I can't see much use for the RAM purge whilst writing a track. However, it could come in handy if effects like VST reverbs are used with finished tracks. Mind you, then there's MIR...

DG
Nuendo 6.03, 4.3
2 x Intel Xeon x5675 3.07GHz Hex Core
48GB RAM
Windows 7 (x64)Pro
RME Multiface II
Intensity
ATI HD5400 series graphics card
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 01:26
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
It would really all depend on your work flow. If you know for a fact that you're finished with a track, you could unload some of the samples. This would give you some head room to add more instruments if you need them.

It doesn't benefit during the 'making' stage or if you come back and need to add a part to a track, as you'll just have to reload everything.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 04:35
by JMBurrell
Joined on Thu, Sep 22 2005, Spartanburg, SC, Posts 67
Okay, now that I'm asking questions and have become the bain of the VSL community, it won't hurt to ask another.

How is percussion handled through the new VI? Since it is not multi-timbral how are multiple percussion instruments handled? Hopefully it isn't an instrument per instance as this would not be a good thing. There must be a way to stack multiple percussion instruments in one VI and have the parts play back correctly.

Just curious.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 18:33
by g.beljon
Joined on Wed, Apr 14 2004, Netherlands, Posts 277
Hello,

Maybe I understand it all wrong: but how would I then make an orchestral set-up using VI? That's certainly more than 64 instruments!

Gerard Beljon
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 18:54
by Existence
Joined on Mon, Sep 20 2004, Seattle, WA, Posts 30
I must admit that this has me confused as well. Each VI instance only provides a single midi channel, and a single stereo output? So, for instance, a basic string quartet would require four active instances? And if I want to have say Pizz. violins play alongside legato violins this would require two instances? This makes no sense at all. Even the basic NI Kompakt player can handle 8 midi channels/audio outputs...
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