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Posted on Sun, Dec 20 2020 11:10
by fatis12_24918
Joined on Sat, Dec 16 2006, Posts 292

A quick introduction of the topic, and a few questions for Dietz and the VSL experts:

Synchron-ized libraries offer by default several new features vs. the VI original version:

- a Synchron Player articulation management and sample storage/playback that can offer some workflow and performance advantage or alternatives.

- a sophisticated internal mixer, with MIX presets, powered by Synchron Stage IR and FX chain, masterfully crafted and ready-to-use, providing a sound ready to mix with Synchron collection libraries, and other Synchron-ized libraries "out-of-the-box".

But of course, the "Synchron StageA" preset and default IR are not limiting the use and application of the Synchron-ized libraries. The pristine dry sound of the library is still available, eQ, IR, balance, power-pan and FX chain are fully customizable, and they can be activated or excluded on demand according the user's need and intention.

This important feature enable the use of any external positioning, virtual stage, and ambience effect chain, and of course, the use of MIR Pro with different venues, or in case of the Synchron StageA venue, of different positions and mic settings on the stage, compared to the default Synchron-ized presets.

The Synchron Player engine has been already programmed to interact with VE Pro and MIR Pro in a pretty intelligent way: e.g. it automatically deactivate some eQ and IRs if a preset is loaded into MIR Pro, and MIR  "guess" function is recognizing the Synchron-ized library and loading the corresponding instrument profile, including characters and Room Eq.

I've the following open questions and comments to be verified by the VSL team:

- is the "intended and proper" use of Synchron-ized libraries into MIR Pro described in any manual or tutorial? (perhaps it is, but I didn't find it yet)

- for the Synchron-ized Dimension Strings sections "all players" a default preset is missing the position of single players into the section (because it is supposed to be defined by the IR, but the IR is now disabled to let you work with MIR instead...).

I suppose it can be restored manually, perhaps following the example of the "noCon" presets: the pan balance of each player is different and is defining the relative position, then the power-pan is defining the stereo field. What's the recommended power-pan for best compatibility with the MIR Pro "8 players" etc.? Is the single player eQ helping in this case, or is it interfering with the MIR instrument profile?

(it obviously interfere with a solo instrument profile, but I'm not sure about the whole section profile).

Yes, I did experiment and had my ears judge, but a technically correct briefing should help a lot to start and guide the research: thank you in advance for any hint and suggestions on the topic!

Posted on Mon, Dec 21 2020 16:08
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7582

In short: MIRx isn't integrated with Synchron Player yet. The following is not a specific answer to your questions, but a general one: According to VSL's headquarter it's safe to say that within Q1 2021 there will be library updates for all Synchronized Library Products, which will enable a workflow similar to VI based libraries when used within MIR projects.

HTH,

/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Mon, Dec 21 2020 21:25
by fatis12_24918
Joined on Sat, Dec 16 2006, Posts 292

Thank you for the kind answer.

I appreciate the good news, because I think it makes a lot of sense VSL takes care of the MIR workflow with Synchronized Libraries as well, being evident the softwares were already prepared to interact.

Posted on Tue, Dec 22 2020 00:33
by Dewdman42
Joined on Tue, Feb 27 2018, Park City, Utah, Posts 642

Originally Posted by: fatis12_24918 Go to Quoted Post

- for the Synchron-ized Dimension Strings sections "all players" a default preset is missing the position of single players into the section (because it is supposed to be defined by the IR, but the IR is now disabled to let you work with MIR instead...).

Do the Synchronized Dimension strings have panning information in the actual IR's?  I would expect them to have Early Reflection data, which mainly would infer depth.  But I do see that the mixer settings for players 1-8 are all set to the middle, no panning information is there in the Synchron Mixer Panner...

The default I see in, for example, 1st Violins full, the IR's are only set to 20% wet...so...  I have to say that basically there is not much panning information on a per player basis in synchronized dimension strings coming from neither IR's nor from the mixer panning...in terms of separating each of the 8 players.  Its not there in the presets..  

The intention, I believe, is to present an entire section as a single unified sound.....which then you would manipulate the panning of the section, using MIRPro, or whatever else you might be using...  I do not think they intended with this product to present a section sound where the position of each of the players has been absolutely positioned in a stereo field within the section.  Its probably there a little bit in the IR's, but at only 20%, its mainly going to effect in subtle ways the reverb, and the direct sound will not be panned at all.  You can achieve much better results in MirPro, IMHO.

If you want to separate and control the panning and positioning of each seperate player, then you should use a dedicated instance of Synchron player for each string player...each one will feed to a seperate MirPro icon, which you can then position on the stage as you wish.

5,1 MacPro 12core X 3.46ghz, 128gb ram, RX580 video, OSX Catalina on OpenCore, VSL (almost everything), LogicPro, Cubase10, StudioOne, DP9, Reaper, Dorico, Finale, MuseScore, Notion6, EW Hollywood Orch, Kirk Hunter, GPO, much more..
Posted on Tue, Dec 22 2020 09:34
by fatis12_24918
Joined on Sat, Dec 16 2006, Posts 292

Originally Posted by: Dewdman42 Go to Quoted Post

Do the Synchronized Dimension strings have panning information in the actual IR's?  I would expect them to have Early Reflection data, ...

In theory that should be possible (e.g. if the IR was generated by the MIR engine, or similar process) and looking to the way all the Synchronized instruments (e.g. Woodwinds and SE) are programmed, it seems the Balance helps to fine-tune the panning, but part of the job being made by IR. That's the reason of my assumption and interpretation of the VSL claims about the product features...

but it's just my very personal opinion, and it can be totally wrong:  that was the reason for asking the VSL team for explanation and recommendations.

(by the way that should be measurable, isolating the signal and sending it to an analyzer, but I didn't take the time yet, in the hope there was already official documentation or statements about it by VSL.)

Posted on Tue, Dec 22 2020 16:08
by Dewdman42
Joined on Tue, Feb 27 2018, Park City, Utah, Posts 642

As I said, the factory mixer settings have the ir set to only 20% wet. The dry sound of the instrument would mainly effect positioning. That being said it’s quite possible it does! Depends on the mic positioning used to record each of the 8 players.

5,1 MacPro 12core X 3.46ghz, 128gb ram, RX580 video, OSX Catalina on OpenCore, VSL (almost everything), LogicPro, Cubase10, StudioOne, DP9, Reaper, Dorico, Finale, MuseScore, Notion6, EW Hollywood Orch, Kirk Hunter, GPO, much more..
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