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Stereo image shifting in the VI matrix patches
Last post Sun, Nov 27 2005 by Dietz, 10 replies.
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Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 05:33
by edhamilton
Joined on Thu, Jul 17 2003, Posts 109
OK. i am pissed about the VIP upgrade path but..
As I watched the demo videos there were blatant problems with the stereo image shifting within a matrix.

The more complicated the matrix (meaning the more patches being switched between) .. the worse the problem.

You could really hear the shifting stereo spread and even the position of the performer being sampled.

There were always small issues like this within VSL but the VI version seems to really expose it.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 05:55
by magates
Joined on Thu, Aug 14 2003, Los Angeles CA, Posts 484
well there was little reverb on that demo and they were shifiting through patches at a rate that might not be used in a "typical" performance but why am I even trying to defend them???? No clue.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 06:04
by jbm
Joined on Fri, Jan 16 2004, Posts 1150
yes, you are pissed off... stereo-image shifting has been there all along. It's probably just more obvious now because you're hearing more different articulations placed side-by-side in rapid succession. The easiest solution? Narrow the instrument's stereo field in your mix.

J.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 06:39
by edhamilton
Joined on Thu, Jul 17 2003, Posts 109
Yeah - that's what I figured.
I know VSL was meticulous in their recording methods but discrepencies were bound to occur and the new VI highights them with the new matrix.

The stereo image thing won't stop me from buying it. The VI is simply incredibly powerful.
But the VIP price WILL stop me from buying it.
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 12:12
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7616
I tried to give an explanation for this phenomenon several times ... this perceived stereo-movement of a source that we consider to be "mono" or hard centered is completly natural and more or less obvious in any room. Do a short test in your own listening environment: Create a _slow_ sinus sweep and listen to it from one fixed position; you will hear the imaging drifting around quite a bit. The same happens with the sound of an instrument, playing in front of a stereo-microphone.

HTH,
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 12:27
by Laurent
Joined on Thu, Sep 05 2002, Paris, Posts 337
jbm you're right, narrowing the instruments should help.
Dietz, maybe, it's really hard to record a solo violin and asking him not to move. Any variation of the instuments handling, little higher, or down when playing giipsy precise fast notes make the stereo image moving.
A musicien always move his instrument and his body, according to the type of sonority he has to produceā€¦
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 12:50
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7616
Laurent, although you are right with your examples, this _adds_ to the phenomenon I described above. A perceptived shifting of the stereo image will happen in almost every "real" room, even from a mathematically steady and fixed source (therefore the suggested test with an synthesized sinus-sweep, played through loudspeakes). This is due to room-nodes and resonances within the instrument (i.e. the loudspeaker), and several other factors.
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 14:39
by Laurent
Joined on Thu, Sep 05 2002, Paris, Posts 337
Dietz, thanks for your very detailled explanations.
BTW, any idea when the Discount Calculator will be up again ?
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 15:06
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7616
Sorry, that's not my area, so I can't give you a serious answer here, but I know for sure that our Marketing- and Website-people are working hard on this issue.
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sun, Nov 27 2005 15:09
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7616
BTW - a good introduction into room acoustics can be found here:

-> http://www.ethanwiner.com/acoustics.html

Several aspects I mentioned in my postings above are covered here in a comprehensible way.

HTH,
/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
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