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What library should I buy?
Last post Sat, May 26 2007 by Beat Kaufmann, 11 replies.
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Posted on Wed, May 16 2007 08:58
by Algreco
Joined on Sat, May 05 2007, Posts 7
I currently use the first edition of Orchestral Cube. Bought it couple of years ago.
Now I start wanting more.

I have a chance to buy at lower price VSL libraries. Those include the entire Performance set, Pro edition and the entire Horizon series.

But I'm confused.
Does VSL repeat samples in different libraries? do they use the same samples from Performance Pro in Horizon? Would I need Opus 1 AND 2 or just 2?

Is Performance Pro + Horizon = Symphonic Cube or is it an entirelly different set of samples?

Is there somewhere a comparison chart you could reffer me to?

Many thanks for your help, Confused
Alg
Posted on Wed, May 16 2007 09:44
by cm
Joined on Fri, Dec 20 2002, vienna, Posts 9039
alg, basically the products represent an upgrade path ... first edition -> pro edition -> Vienna Instruments Collections, each larger product inherits the samples from the product you upgraded from (that's why you get a VIP price or discount for your already registered products)
opus 1 + 2 are taken entirely from the pro edition.

the Symphonic Cube (I) has to be understood as bundle of collections 1-10 from Vienna Instruments I, the Orchestral Cube contains the single note sample libraries strings, brass&woodwinds, percussions, the Orchestral Cube + Performance Set is the Complete Orchestral Package.

several horizon series products overlap with the pro edition (solo strings, mallets, ect), others are seperate (saxophones, guitars)

christian
and remember: a CRAY is the only computer that runs an endless loop in just four hours ...
Posted on Fri, May 18 2007 13:43
by Algreco
Joined on Sat, May 05 2007, Posts 7
Dear Christian.

My reply is late because i spent couple more hours trying to compare articulations between products and I still have not managed to find out which is which.
I can see that Op. 2 offers articulations that also exist in the Pro Performance set, yet it's named differently. That's very confusing.

So just to make this short...
Would you say I will have the complete vienna orchestral capabilities (or close to complete) if I get the Orchestral Cube Pro + Performance set Pro? And evetually, which of the Horizon should I get?

Sorry for being so clueless Surpriseops:

Greets,
ALG
Posted on Fri, May 18 2007 19:34
by Paul
Joined on Sat, Aug 03 2002, Vienna, Posts 11251
Hi Alg,

the Pro Edition contains 385.000 samples (here´s the product page), all of these samples are also contained in the Symphonic Cube, which holds more than 800.000 samples and is powered by our own sample player, the Vienna Instruments.

The Pro Edition and the Horizon Series are the predecessors of the Symphonic Cube.

The Vienna Instruments that are essential for the Symphonic Cube really make the difference, it´s not just the sample number. This is best illustrated by the Video Tutorials for the Vienna Instruments you find here.

Hope that helps!

Best,

Paul
Paul Kopf
Product Manager - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Fri, May 18 2007 21:58
by Beat Kaufmann
Joined on Fri, Jan 03 2003, Switzerland/Brugg, Posts 1714
Algreco wrote:

...Is there somewhere a comparison chart you could reffer me to?
Many thanks for your help, Confused
Alg

Click on "Products" / "Vienna Instrument I or II" and select a product then > for example Solo Strings. Now click on "Articulations".
It opens a frame(table) with two columns: Existing Content and New Content.
The "New Content" shows all the added articulations with the VI.
As a user who knows both - the Pro Edition and the VI...

With the Vi you have no more routing of the Super Angry performance tool, no more loading of different legatos (slow/fast), no more deleays of some legatos, no more sweat, no more beiing at the end of my tether, no more...

The VI allows us a cool, nice and stressles workflow and then... splendid music.


All the best
Beat Kaufmann
www.musik-produktion-createc.ch (Konzertaufnahmen, Musik mit Samples)
at www.beat-kaufmann.com : MIXING an ORCHESTRA - TUTORIAL
Posted on Fri, May 18 2007 23:52
by Algreco
Joined on Sat, May 05 2007, Posts 7
Thanks for replying Paul. I start understanding.

I took a look at the articulation charts as you suggested Beat, thnx.

I see the VI is the "latest thing" and it does sound profoundly impressive. you say it's a collection that comes with your own sample player. But the samples are remain in the same structure, just more of them (about twice as many).
Could this sample player function with the PRO edition?
Is it that sample player that makes your experience so pleasant Beat? Besides the improvement of simplicity, does it effect that actual result by other then the delays of some legatos? I don't mind loading different legatos if that's the problem..

Is VI (the sample p layer)a replacement for GigaStudio or an improved Performance Tool?

Many thanks for your patience [Wink]
Posted on Sat, May 19 2007 08:05
by Paul
Joined on Sat, Aug 03 2002, Vienna, Posts 11251
Hi Algreco,

you can not "fill" the Pro Edition into the Vienna Instruments. You don´t need an additional sample player to play with the Vienna Instruments collections, so if you want to put it this way, the Vienna Instruments are both a "replacement" for GigaStudio AND a totally enhanced Performance Tool. There are many new articulations available that only make sense with the Vienna Instruments (Performance Trills, Fast Legatos...) and there are a lot of feature that only work within the Vienna Instruments, such as Vel Xfade, Cell Xfade.....

Maybe it will help to know what exactly you expect from a library: What are your musical goals? If you are thinking about the price point, please remember that the Vienna instruments collections are always divided into a Standard Library and an Extended Library, so that you could start with the Standard Library and then upgrade to the Extended Library step by step Wink

Best,

Paul
Paul Kopf
Product Manager - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sat, May 19 2007 08:19
by Beat Kaufmann
Joined on Fri, Jan 03 2003, Switzerland/Brugg, Posts 1714
Algreco wrote:
...Could this sample player function with the PRO edition?
Is it that sample player that makes your experience so pleasant Beat? Besides the improvement of simplicity, does it effect that actual result by other then the delays of some legatos? I don't mind loading different legatos if that's the problem...Is VI (the sample p layer)a replacement for GigaStudio or an improved Performance Tool? [Wink]

Hi Algreco
All the samples are compressed to a few data packages for every instrument. These data packages can only be decoded by the VI. The VI is now the Sample-Player and the Performance Tool as well. All the necessary links are internally done. So it select automatically between different legatos, repetitions, stac1/stac2, release-samples and so on. These selections can depend on your playing speed or other parameters.
Knowing this the answers are given:
- The VI player can "only" play the special prepared VI-data-packages. It is not a replacement of any other player.
- It is a high tuned player prepared to play the new VI-adapted VSL-samples.
- You can't use it for any other work.

Best,
Beat
www.musik-produktion-createc.ch (Konzertaufnahmen, Musik mit Samples)
at www.beat-kaufmann.com : MIXING an ORCHESTRA - TUTORIAL
Posted on Sat, May 26 2007 19:46
by Algreco
Joined on Sat, May 05 2007, Posts 7
Hey guys,

Thanks for all the info. I can now judge more intelligently what library I should get.
Many thanks,
ALG Big Smile
Posted on Sat, May 26 2007 20:09
by Algreco
Joined on Sat, May 05 2007, Posts 7
just one more thing though,
Beat.. I went to your site and listened to your examples within the tutorials of VSL and VI with that passage of a solo violin demonstrating different playing techniques.
The resault sounded the same to me. I suppose you are using the same samples, just a different player (the VI)?
But one observation though. I don't want to be annoying, but of all techniques I found the legato the least believable. the problem is I can here it's a sample, I hear the sample starting and getting chopped to go to another. I suppose that's something which is unavoidable?? it's true that the room reverb you add does help a little, but isn't it because it's less accurate?
Maybe I was listening to an outdated example of legato?
Greets
Posted on Sat, May 26 2007 23:08
by Beat Kaufmann
Joined on Fri, Jan 03 2003, Switzerland/Brugg, Posts 1714
Algreco wrote:
just one more thing though,
Beat.. I went to your site and listened to your examples within the tutorials of VSL and VI with that passage of a solo violin demonstrating different playing techniques.
The resault sounded the same to me. I suppose you are using the same samples... Maybe I was listening to an outdated example of legato?...
Greets

Yes I used the same samples (sound). I only adapted the theory to the new VI. I don't want to show the sound quality of the VI but the new handling of the samples.

With the next homepage update I will add a remark, that the sound samples in the VI-Midi-tutorial are taken from the VSL-Midi-tutorial.

If you want to listen to the new quality of the VI Violin:
http://www.beat-kaufmann.com/VSL_New_VI/BK_DeFesch_Sonata_in_G_SVI_VI_06.mp3
http://www.beat-kaufmann.com/VSL_New_VI/BK_Solo_Violin_Demo.mp3
http://www.beat-kaufmann.com/VSL_New_VI_U/BK_Nice_Meeting_VI_07.mp3
or go to the VI demos here at VSL.

Beat
www.musik-produktion-createc.ch (Konzertaufnahmen, Musik mit Samples)
at www.beat-kaufmann.com : MIXING an ORCHESTRA - TUTORIAL
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