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Bosendorfer Imperial vs. Synthogy Ivory
Last post Fri, Mar 30 2007 by Nathan Allen Pinard, 7 replies.
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Posted on Wed, Mar 28 2007 14:53
by ColinThomson
Joined on Sun, Mar 25 2007, Posts 242
Unless I am missing something, for only $4 more you can get Ivory and have not only a Bosendorfer but also a Steinway and a Yamaha. Would there be any reason to go with the VSL product? Thanks
Colin Thomson
Tags: Bösendorfer
Posted on Wed, Mar 28 2007 15:12
by ColinThomson
Joined on Sun, Mar 25 2007, Posts 242
Forgot to mention something. We might have a new contender in April. Quantum Leap Pianos, $445. Here are the pianos they say it will include: Bechstein D-280 Concert Grand Piano, Steinway D Concert Grand Piano, Bösendorfer 290 Concert Grand Piano, Yamaha C7 Grand Piano. They claim to have 270 GB of content at 24-bit/44.1k quality. Check out this website


Very impressive looking.[/url]
Colin Thomson
Posted on Wed, Mar 28 2007 15:49
by michi
Joined on Sun, Dec 22 2002, vienna, Posts 511
the idea behind our Vienna Instruments Bösendorfer is to provide our customers with a manufactor-supported instrument, because we are the only company with a real cooperation with Bösendorfer. our product is the basic feature for their prototype. we offer two different microphone types for our piano: closed and distant. we've recorded repetition-samples and the transition from pedal off to pedal on is as natural as the real thing. one will get 97 keys. there is of course a coherence between 40 GB of data and the quality of the product.
so, these are my reasons why i think our piano is a good one.

cheers, michael
Posted on Fri, Mar 30 2007 05:51
by hermitage59
Joined on Fri, Mar 25 2005, The Slavic Cultural Empire, Posts 1050
Colin, you've made some interesting observations.

I'm not sure though, that a comparison is viable, given your criteria of 'how many pianos and GB's do i get for my cash?' There have been libraries in the past that offered 'volume' instrument deals that didn't always match up to the hype. Now, to be objective, that may not be the case in the examples you've given, and the packages you describe could be fine offers. I guess the questions could be, what do you want to use the pianos for? Which style do you write in, predominately? Are you looking to cover a variety of genres, and are trying to encapsulate all in one purchase?
Ivory has a pretty good reputation, and their marketing has obviously been highly successful. There are issues for some, reading some of the comments in various fora, but again objectively, there are also users who have enjoyed success using this particular package.
The choice you make is yours, obviously, but i would tend to a finely tuned and prepared instrument, and then there's the recording technique, and 'sound' that is VSL, over others, who often tend to built in effects, that cannot be removed. I find that prospect limiting, particularly when writing, as i do, for concert. It is entirely useful (IMHO) to 'place' an instrument wherever you wish, in whatever size hall you wish, and with VSL, more than any other library this is true, because of the wonderful transparency of recording technique. It's been said more than once, and mistakenly in my opinion, that VSL record a dry sound. Frankly, I don't understand this impression at all, unless the user wants a 'pre-programmed tone and placement' that will sound the same whatever he writes. I don't think the sound's dry at all, quite the contrary. The tone is rich, and thankfully, effects are absent, letting the user make the choice of how the instrument sounds, and where from.

The VSL Bosendorfer, for me at least has a wonderful tone, and as recent demos have shown, a clear and distinct profile, that lends itself to placement, and enrichment for a number of scenarios. As a former concert piano player, i've been fortunate to play on some fine instruments, and gained some preferences in what sort of tone i prefer. I like the Bosendorfer sound, and others may prefer something else. I'd like to hear from one the talented chaps here, a thinly written work, maybe Satie, as i think the 'space' would really show the instrument in its glory. Or as an accompaniment to a solo instrument. It would certainly be a demonstration of flexibility.
(Amusingly, I also moonlighted in rock, funk and jazz, and have enjoyed the unique experience of belting out the odd rock tune or two on a properly prepared concert piano! Seems like heresy, yes?)

Given the widely acknowledged excellent software that VSL have designed as a VI, it's an ideal opportunity for many, including those users who aren't neccessarily keyboard players to capture a real piano sound, and add their own distinctive 'aural signature.' I find this approach imminently favourable, over other packages that have pre-programmed tone and effects that i'm stuck with.

If your criteria is, ultimately, price and quantity first, then the packages you've mentioned may well be desirable for you. Personally, i'd rather one piano, superbly recorded in excellence of detail to the nth degree, that enabled me to concentrate on good composition and orchestration, and distinctive enough to add to, and compliment, my personal 'aural style.'

I wish you luck in your search,


[i:d09f9c4039][color=blue:d09f9c4039][size=11:d09f9c4039]Orchestration is the art of making your own choice.....
Genius is the art of making the right choice....[/size:d09f9c4039][/color:d09f9c4039][/i:d09f9c4039]
Posted on Fri, Mar 30 2007 11:34
by nliberg
Joined on Fri, Dec 02 2005, Posts 232
It would be interesting to see a comparison between the VI Bösendorfer and some of Sampletekk's larger pianos (TBO and 7CG). They seem to have about the same number of samples per note but use them in completely different ways. The VSL instrument uses repetitions whereas the Sampletekk pianos use a large number of velocity layers instead. To me the later approach seems intuitively better since with 31 velocity layers the chance of triggering the same sample twice is not very big, so one gets both variation and dynamics at the same time and might end up using a larger proportion of the samples. I find the pedal down transitions of the VI Bösendorfer lib very interesting though. I don't know if anyone else has done this. Does it work well in practice? Are there any demos showing only this effect in an exposed way?
Posted on Fri, Mar 30 2007 12:00
by ColinThomson
Joined on Sun, Mar 25 2007, Posts 242
I have seen the 97 keys thing as a highly marketed part of the BÖSENDORFER IMPERIAL, but (sorry to sound so niave) I don't understand how it will help me since I only have 88 keys on my midi-controller. I assume it is in keyswitching? Is it easy to do it fluently?
I am all in favor of only getting one piano if it actaully sounds better, and was recorded more painstakingly. But to tell that for sure it seems that I really need to play it, because for some reason I have a hard time telling from the demos. Thanks for the replies.
Colin Thomson
Posted on Fri, Mar 30 2007 12:08
by Nathan Allen Pinard
Joined on Thu, Jun 15 2006, Portland, OR, Posts 183
I bought the Bosendorfer and the Quantum Leap series both. Simpliy because in my experience you can never have too many piano sounds.
Nathan Allen Pinard
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