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  4. Using 32 Bit VST plugins in 64 Bit VE possible?

  • Using 32 Bit VST plugins in 64 Bit VE possible?

    P
    P

    Dear Vienna Team,

    I just upgraded my system to Quad Core, 8GB (Vista 64) and now I would like

    to use VE 64 bit. However, I can not find a way to use 32 bit VST plugins in the

    64 bit version of Vienna Ensemble. Unfortunately many plugins are not yet

    available in a 64 bit version; it probably gonna take a while before this changes.

    Is there any way to make 32 bit plugins work inside of VE 64?

    PS: is a good reverb available that supports 64 bit? In general it would be great

    to have a list of plugins that are compatible with VE! 

    Thanks in advance,

    Peter
  • H
    H

    Sorry, it's not possible to run 32 bit plugins in VE 64.

    best

    Herb
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    @herb said:

    Sorry, it's not possible to run 32 bit plugins in VE 64.

    best

    Herb

     

    Too bad - someone has to write an application to bridge 32 and 64 bit worlds...

    Is any info about compatible plugins available (in particular reverb and EQ)?

    Thanks,

    Peter 
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC

    if the sequencer you are using is 32bit or provides a bit-bridge couldn't you insert them there?

    christian

    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
  • J
    J

    Look at this thread:

    http://community.vsl.co.at/forums/t/17194.aspx

    Justin
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    @cm said:

    if the sequencer you are using is 32bit or provides a bit-bridge couldn't you insert them there?

    christian

     

    Hello Christian,

    my main sequencer is Cubase SX, so no problem there. However, with other sequencers it might

    not be that easy. Just to give an example: I don't think this would work with Sibelius. (might be

    wrong though, I don't have it yet)

    I just like the simple and elegant interface of VE and would prefer to be able to setup complete

    sections within VE, including reverb, EQ and whatever might be needed.

    Unfortunately I am not aware of any application that would allow to use 32 bit plugs in VE 64.

    And it is obvious VSL doesn't want to add support for 32 bit plugins either. [:(]

    I will take this as a programming challenge and implement it myself. [;)]

    Best regards,

    Peter
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    @cm said:

    if the sequencer you are using is 32bit or provides a bit-bridge couldn't you insert them there?

    christian

     

    Hello Christian,

    my main sequencer is Cubase SX, so no problem there. However, with other sequencers it might

    not be that easy. Just to give an example: I don't think this would work with Sibelius. (might be

    wrong though, I don't have it yet)

    Peter

    Of course you can use 32bit plugs in Sibelius. You can't use 64bit ones though, except for VE. Clever VSL........!

    DG
  • J
    J

    Izotope Ozone works in VE 64 bit.  Its a great tool however doesn't have a convolution reverb engine.  I wonder if VSL would consider adding Convolution as part of VE?

    Peter - I would be interested to see if you could come up with a VST bridge for VE!

    Justin
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    @DG said:

    Of course you can use 32bit plugs in Sibelius. You can't use 64bit ones though, except for VE. Clever VSL........!

    DG

    Hello DG,

    I am not asking whether I can use 32 bit plugins in Sibelius, I know this works. I want to use 64 bit VE in Sibelius.

    Well that will work too, so far so good. But I can't use a 32 bit plugin within VE 64. Why do I bother?

    The problem is that Sibelius does (IMHO) only support one stereo output from the plugins. So I can not route different

    instruments out of VE and deal with EQ, reverb etc. outside of VE. And, last time I looked, the mixer in Sibelius was

    somewhat limited anyway.

    That's why I want to use 32 bit plugins within 64 bit VE. I could take advantage of all my memory and use VE's mixer

    to workaround limitations of some hosts. Afterall, why should VSL have done all the work to create that mixer, with

    inserts, sends and groups, if we can't use it?

    That's why I want to use 32 plugs in 64 bit Vienna Ensemble... But I see no one else needs it😊

    Peter
  • D
    D

    Peter, I understand what you want, but this VST support is very new in Sibelius, so I doubt that 64bit will be given any priority. After all, Sib isn't even LAA yet. [:O]

    DG
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    @DG said:

    Peter, I understand what you want, but this VST support is very new in Sibelius, so I doubt that 64bit will be given any priority. After all, Sib isn't even LAA yet.

    DG

    DG, I am not aking for 64 bit support in Sibelius - VE 64 should already work, thanks VSL!

    But 32 bit plugs don't work in the 64 bit VE...

    Peter 
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC

    ahem ... maybe i misunderstand ... but wouldn't your request be the other way around, because VE is a plugin into sib and not sib in VE ... so we would need to have sib accepting 64bit plugins first ...

     

    btw: i have not tried to install sib on a 64bit computer so far - is that what you are running?

    christian

    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
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    @cm said:

    ahem ... maybe i misunderstand ... but wouldn't your request be the other way around, because VE is a plugin into sib and not sib in VE ... so we would need to have sib accepting 64bit plugins first ...

    btw: i have not tried to install sib on a 64bit computer so far - is that what you are running?

    christian

     

    Hi Christian,

    I really seem to have a problem to make clear what I want. I will try a last time:

    I want to use VE as a plugin from within a 32 bit host, let it be Cubase SX or Sibelius,

    or what ever host one prefers. VE works perfectly within 32 bit cubase. So my

    assumption was it will also work in Sibelius. The cool thing about the VE plugin is

    that it uses a 64 bit server on my 64 bit vista, even from within a 32 bit host.

    That allows to use most of´my ram and leaves the address space of the host

    mostly untouched. Great so far.

    The only limitations is that the VE 64 bit engine (which is a separate process) does

    not support 32 bit plugins.

    Now, if I want to load EQ or reverb plugins within the VE 64 instance, the trouble starts,

    as most plugins are not yet available in a 64 bit version. Of course I can just start the

    32 bit VE server and use all the plugins, but then I can't use all the memory:


    Cubase SX host (32 bit application, running on Vista 64)

       Vienna Ensemble as a plugin (32 bit plugin, connects to 64 bit VE server)

           EQ as a plugin in Vienna Ensemble (needs to be 64 bit) *** here is the problem[;)]

           Reverb as a plugin in Vienna Ensemble (needs to be 64 bit) *** here is the problem[;)]

    You are right, Cubase has a mixer itself, so instead of using plugins inside of VE, I can route

    all the instruments out of VE and mix in Cubase, including all the plugins that Cubase can

    handle.

    Sibelius is another story, the mixer is limited and I don't think Sib supports the 32 outputs

    of VE. So it would be a better choice to use VE's mixer. This is where it would really be

    handy to have all the 32 bit plugins available.

    So I don't need a VE that would work as a plugin in a 64 bit host, but a 64 bit VE server,

    that can load 32 bit plugins. Maybe the confusion is that while VE is used as a plugin in

    a host like Cubase, the VE server is itself a host for other plugins, like EQ or reverb. 

    I am sorry that I just can't explain it better in written english. If you are interested I might

    give you a call and try to explain in German on the phone what I want to do, why and how

    that would work. Just send me a PM with a number and a time when this makes sense...

    Peter
  • cmC
    VSL Team
    cmC

    peter, now i understand your setup ... but i can't say much more than herb already did ... 32bit plugins are currently not supported in a 64bit VE.

    please also understand that we cannot comment on any possible option of a bit-bridge or similar function in the future.

     

    btw just thinking loud ... having a 32bit app bridged to a 64bit app inserted a 32bit plugin and then go the whole route back to your audio device ... doesn't sound too efficient to me ... though i understand it would be nice to have of no other options are available

     

    maybe a possible compromise would be to group several tracks to busses and route these back to the host

    christian

    and remember: only a CRAY can run an endless loop in just three seconds.
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    @Another User said:

    btw just thinking loud ... having a 32bit app bridged to a 64bit app inserted a 32bit plugin and then go the whole route back to your audio device ... doesn't sound too efficient to me ... though i understand it would be nice to have of no other options are available

    Of course this is not the optimal solution. The upcoming 64 bit version of Cubase 4 seems to support this kind of bridging;

    they also recommend to use native 64 bit plugins for performance reasons. But currently the number of 64 bit plugins is

    sort of limited...

    And in case of reverb the overhead might not be that importand - the processing itself is pretty expensive anyway.

    And I would expect the overhead to be even less than the overhead to transfer audio channels over the network as this

    is done in FX Teleport or in the upcoming VE 3.

    Theoretical assumptions won't really tell whether this will work. I will try to implement it, then we will know😊

    Peter