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Posted on Wed, Jan 14 2009 10:34
by ChoPraTs
Joined on Tue, Dec 09 2008, Posts 22

Hi all!

I'm David, new user of Vienna Special Edition since this month, January. I'm trying to learning how to use correctly this great library.

First, I'm writing some examples on Sibelius to try special techniques and looking for the best configuration, using the VSL Ensemble Special Edition SoundSet, the manuals and Sibelius 5.2.5 for Mac.

I can see that many techniques work fine: staccatto, pizz, legato, detache, tremolo... But I'm trying to use others that I think that don't work, for example: portamento, mute... Is it possible?


These are my questions:

- How I have to write "portamento" to a solo violin on Sibelius so that it will be played correctly by Vienna Special Edition?

- How I have to write "change to mute" or "mute" to a trumpet on Sibelius so that it will be changed on Vienna Special Edition?

- How can I don't write "tremolo", but introducing the corresponding symbol and it will be played correctly by Vienna Special Edition?


For today, that's all! Sorry if my english is not perfect, I'm spanish.

Posted on Wed, Jan 14 2009 13:48
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

Hi David and welcome to the forum!

For portamento to take effect on your playback you have to update your Sibelius Playback dictionary. Go to Play/Dictionary/Staff Text and add the word portamento. Effect: Sound ID change "+portamento" Until next sound ID change.
You can also add this command to the portamento line. Go to Play/Dictionary/Staff Lines/Portamento and add Sound ID Change "+portamento" Until end of last note under line
 
Take a look at the readme file that came with your sound set. There are some recommendations what else you might want to add to your dictionary.

If you want a muted trumpet in your score, please create two trumpets with different channels on the Playback Devices/Manual Sound Sets page. One time choose "Trumpet" and one time choose "Trumpet mute". In Vienna Ensemble load the appropriate matrices on the same channels you set on the Manual Sound Sets page.
To switch from the "normal" to the muted trumpet, create a Technique Text in Sibelius with the command "mute" or "con sordino". To switch back write "ord.", "normal" or "senza sordino".

Tremolo automatically works with the symbol where 5 lines cross the stem. If you want it also with 3 or 4 lines crossing the stem, make the following change in your Playback Dictionary.
Go to Play/Dictionary/Articulations/16 tremolos (and 8 tremolos) and add the Sound ID change: "+tremolo.unmeasured"

Best wishes,
Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Wed, Jan 14 2009 15:40
by ChoPraTs
Joined on Tue, Dec 09 2008, Posts 22

Thanks. I will try that.

I use the Sibelius SoundSet for Vienna Special Editon, called: VSL Ensemble Special Edition. Is that correct? I have readed on Vienna Special Edition this:

The sound set for VSL Special Edition that is shipped with Sibelius 5.2.5 has been further improved to
work with Vienna Ensemble.  There is no longer the need to download a newer sound set, as per
earlier versions of Sibelius 5. If you have an older version of the sound set please remove the VSL
sound sets from the Sounds folders.

More questions, does some method exist so that the configuration is kept for any score? Because if I create the texts and commands that you've explained, they only appear in the score that they were created, not in others or in a new score.

EDIT: I read the solution on Sibelius Reference.

For today, that's all! Sorry if my english is not perfect, I'm spanish. 

Posted on Wed, Jan 14 2009 16:07
by ChoPraTs
Joined on Tue, Dec 09 2008, Posts 22

About your solution to play "portamento", I tried it, and I can see how Vienna Ensemble changes correctly the sound of violin to play portamento technique, but notes sound very short, and no portamento is listened. Why?

EDIT: Solved! I had a problem with the Metronome, it was assigned to the same channel as violin, and "short notes" that I listened were from metronome "clicks", not from violin.


About your solution to play "mute" sounds, I see in Sibelius exists alredy the text "mute" with the command "+mute". But I think the problem is that Vienna Ensemble uses two different instruments for Trumpet and Trumpet Mute, not the same instrument with diferent techniques or keyswitches.

EDIT: Problem solved! Thanks!


Another question, but this time about this forum. I write different paragraphs pressing the return key, but they don't appear when I publish my comment, all lines appear in the same paragraph.

EDIT: Solved too. In this site go to: Community, Profile, Community and select "Standard" or "Enhanced" on Content Editor. Although I need to create the text into TextEdit or NotePad, and then copy here as Word Text.

Posted on Sun, Jan 18 2009 00:56
by BFingerhut
Joined on Wed, Aug 27 2008, London, Posts 33

Hi Andi,

I got the trumpet mute to work...

I just cannot get the portamento to work... I added all the correct things to the dictionary etc... Am I just creating the wrong symbol in Sibelius? (Lines/Gliss. or Port.)

When I do this, the note with the portamento or Gliss just plays an octave up...

Also, I didn't get a readme file with the soundset download... Where can I get it from?

Thanks,

Ben.

P.S. Sorry to but in on this thread, but it was relevant to what I wanted to ask...

Posted on Sun, Jan 18 2009 09:23
by ChoPraTs
Joined on Tue, Dec 09 2008, Posts 22

Hi,

I don't have any readme file about my soundset, because I use a soundset included on Sibelius. But I found a readme file downloading the previos version of the soundset, it is here, in Vienna page. Go to User Area / DVD Products / Needfull Things. There you'll find two Soundsets for Sibelius. One for each version: 5.1 or 5.2. If you are using Sibelius 5.2.5, you don't need any of this soundsets, because the version included with Sibelius 5.2.5 is better and correct. But, if you want to read this readme file, you can just download these soundsets for that.

I don't know why you can't hear "portamento" correctly. The solution aported in this post, worked fine for me. If I discover something more, I will explain it here.

Posted on Sun, Jan 18 2009 10:12
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

Thanks David!

The sound set that comes with Sibelius 5.2.5 is not better or more correct than the one you can download from our homepage. In fact they are almost identical and the one from our homepage has a few minor updates. To sum it up: Both are fine.

You are right about the readme files. With every sound set you download from our User Area comes such a readme file.

Ben, please take a look at my first reply in this thread how to add the portamento command to your dictionary. If you add both entries, you can switch to portamento with either a techique text "portamento" or with the portamento line from the lines menu.

Best,
Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Sun, Jan 18 2009 14:55
by ChoPraTs
Joined on Tue, Dec 09 2008, Posts 22
andi wrote:

Thanks David!

The sound set that comes with Sibelius 5.2.5 is not better or more correct than the one you can download from our homepage. In fact they are almost identical and the one from our homepage has a few minor updates. To sum it up: Both are fine.

You are right about the readme files. With every sound set you download from our User Area comes such a readme file.

Oh! Thanks. I didn't know that. I have readed in the "Sibelius 5.2 and Vienna Ensemble Setup Guide" (avaliable on User Area > DVD Products > Software) this:

The sound set for VSL Special Edition that is shipped with Sibelius 5.2.5 has been further improved to
work with Vienna Ensemble.  There is no longer the need to download a newer sound set, as per
earlier versions of Sibelius 5. If you have an older version of the sound set please remove the VSL
sound sets from the Sounds folders.

So, I thought that the Sound Set cames with Sibelius 5.2.5 is the most recent. Then, do you think is better to use always the avaliable at the Vienna Webpage?

Posted on Sun, Jan 18 2009 15:50
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

The sound sets from our homepage are always the ones most up to date. When Sibelius 5.2.5 and the document you are refering to were released, the included sound set was the latest version.

Best,
Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 18:35
by lonkaiser
Joined on Wed, Nov 12 2008, Posts 20

This addition of portamento isn't working for me. I added portamento under Staff text, and then to make this clear: there was no '+portamento' option in the pulldown menu under "effect values" so i had to type '+portamento"  in. Is this correct? or should all the Vienna Articulations be available under the pull down menu? if so does that mean it's not reading the soundset correctly?

Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 19:27
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

+portamento is not available from the pulldown menu. Just type it in. It should work then.

With which instrument did you try it? It's only available for the strings.

Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 19:33
by lonkaiser
Joined on Wed, Nov 12 2008, Posts 20

Yeah it's only for strings. i can see it doesn't switch to "portamento" if i view the action as evident in control edit in the playback. somethings up with my articulations. :(

Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 19:40
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

Please check your dictionairy entry again. What exactly did you write (keyword, Sound ID)?

Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 19:42
by lonkaiser
Joined on Wed, Nov 12 2008, Posts 20

i wrote  'portamento'  for staff text  and '+portamento'  for sound ID. no single quotes. Quadruple checked the spelling.

Posted on Tue, Apr 07 2009 21:12
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

You have to be careful with choosing the right instrument in Sibelius. Use Solo Violin, Solo Viola, ... for solo instruments and Violin 1, Violin 2, Violin I, Viola, ... for ensemble strings. The program you choose on the manual sound set page has to match with the instrument.

Beware of the Click! If not muted it can mess up an instrument. If you want to use the click, reserve a percussion channel for it (on the Manual Sound Sets page and in Vienna Ensemble).

After changing (or updating) the sound set for a score, please always reassign all programs on the Manual Sound Set page.

There is a playback bug in Sibelius, which sometimes occurs when the same instrument is used more than once. Normally, it helps to create the problematic instrument once again, cut the content of the old instrument and paste it into the new one.

Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Wed, Apr 08 2009 22:03
by lonkaiser
Joined on Wed, Nov 12 2008, Posts 20

Ok, so I've got Portamento working correctly for the Cello And Viola in the String Quartet, but Violins refuse to comply and i assume this has to do with what you were saying about having two of the same instruments. That seems like a bug that needs to be fixed asap as having two of the same instruments is very common. I tried your suggestions and it didn't help. any other suggestions?

Posted on Thu, Apr 09 2009 07:49
by andi
Joined on Wed, Feb 18 2004, Vienna, Posts 3523

Hello Lon!

If you want to, you can send me your score and playback configuration (xml file and folder of the same name located in Application Data/Sibelius Software/Sibelius 5/Playback Configurations) and I will take a look at it.

Send it to document.write( '<'+'a'+' '+'h'+'r'+'e'+'f'+'='+'"'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'9'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'8'+';'+ '&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'6'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'8'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'4'+'9'+';'+ '&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'0'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'7'+'0'+';'+'&'+'#'+ '3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+ ';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'3'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+ '#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+ '4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'6'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'2'+';'+ '&'+'#'+'4'+'8'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+ '5'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'0'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'9'+ ';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'7'+'0'+';'+'&'+ '#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'0'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'4'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'3'+ '7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'5'+'2'+';'+'"'+'>'+'&'+'#'+'9'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'4'+'6'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+ '1'+'0'+'8'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'2'+'2'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+ '5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'7'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'0'+'5'+';'+'&'+'#'+'6'+'4'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'8'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'5'+';'+'&'+ '#'+'1'+'0'+'8'+';'+'&'+'#'+'4'+'6'+';'+'&'+'#'+'9'+'9'+';'+'&'+'#'+'1'+'1'+'1'+';'+'&'+'#'+'4'+'6'+';'+'&'+'#'+'9'+'7'+';'+'&'+ '#'+'1'+'1'+'6'+';'+'<'+'/'+'a'+'>'); ">

Andi

Andreas Olszewski
Vienna Symphonic Library
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