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muted Synchron Strings?
Last post Tue, Jul 17 2018 by fahl5, 11 replies.
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Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 12:05
by belkina
Joined on Sun, Jun 13 2004, Montreal, Canada, Posts 410

Obviously for now there is no recorded Synchron muted strings. I am trying to use the filter for a con sord. passage, but it has very little effect and even when it does, the sound is really not like con sord. I'm using LP6 with a filter value of mayb e10. 

Can anyone suggest a better way to imitate the con sord?

Thanks,

Alan Belkin

Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 12:16
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Hall One, Posts 932

Of course as usual I expect that Synchron Strings II will include kind of a complete Sampleset with Sordino. For Now I did the nearly same:

1) avoid as much as possible scores demanding sordinoi-Passages, and

2) if there still some not avoidable I use not LPF6 but LPF12 completly open for non sordino and completly closed for the sordino effect.

You can hear the result in the Tschaikowsky Serenade at the Ending of the III. Movement where the strings repeat the slow chordmelody from the start of the movement but this time muted. the slow Beginning of the IV.Movement is likewise LPF12-muted you can hear the difference, when the high tempo of the movement starts.

I confess it is not as beautiful as real sordino-samples are, but it is more than nothing (and comparable to many other Libraries which only provicde that "Filtertrick" or even worser only Sordino-sustains) I hope that helps at least a bit for the moment. Otherwise you probably have to wait for further Synchronstring releases.

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3443 mp3 with 162 hours of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de ...Synchron-Strings explored in 44 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Player Strings.

...anything comparable anywhere?
Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 20:30
by crusoe
Joined on Sat, Dec 26 2009, Posts 90

I came across this product, which is supposed to do exactly what you want. Just in case you didn't see it. After listening to the provided demos I conclude that the matter is not as simple as applying a filter, since even a dedicated product does only a rough approximation. But you can judge for yourself.

Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 20:51
by belkina
Joined on Sun, Jun 13 2004, Montreal, Canada, Posts 410

Thank for the reference. I listened to their demos, but to be honest I don't find them at all convincing. 

Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 21:17
by fatis12_24918
Joined on Sat, Dec 16 2006, Posts 214

Originally Posted by: crusoe Go to Quoted Post

I came across this product, which is supposed to do exactly what you want. Just in case you didn't see it. After listening to the provided demos I conclude that the matter is not as simple as applying a filter, since even a dedicated product does only a rough approximation. But you can judge for yourself.

This is a good reference, tanks for posting.

Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 21:34
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Hall One, Posts 932

If I remeber right, than numerical sounds already worked together with VSL for some Impuls responses of a VSL MIR precursor, what inspire some confidence. Nevertheless, I would expect to get sooner or later real sordino-sample for the Synchron-Strings to, as we got them for Appassionata, Chamber, Solo or Dimensionstrings..

Insofar I would only search for am interim solution. On the other hand it seemed to me reasonable to know, if those Timbral-responses are compatible with the new Synchron-Player-Strings. I am at least not sure about. 

The best solution: try to postpone Project that demands a larger extend of muted strings until we got real sordino-patches

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3443 mp3 with 162 hours of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de ...Synchron-Strings explored in 44 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Player Strings.

...anything comparable anywhere?
Posted on Mon, Jul 16 2018 22:09
by LAJ
Joined on Sun, Dec 13 2009, Posts 401

I am not sure if muted Strings are a good idea for this series at this time.
It is better to „mask“ the sound of SS1 with one or two existing muted VI-Libraries and to use the Filter Option of the SYPlayer to create the fake-mute basis.

That saves storage and nerves of some people.


—Lurker-mode—
Posted on Tue, Jul 17 2018 15:46
by strytten
Joined on Sat, Jan 06 2007, Posts 65

Sorry, I strongly disagree. Con sordino is so important and the only way to get that sound is to sample the real thing. It's a "must have" and I will create whatever extra drive space is necessary. By the way, if I postpone my projects that involve con sordino, I'll have nothing to do.

Steve Trytten
All VSL strings, winds, and most others, Vienna Imperial, VE Pro, MIR, Protools 10.3.5, Mac Mntn Lion 12 core, LASS, Ivory, Kontakt 5, Spitfire Sable Strings
Posted on Tue, Jul 17 2018 16:40
by LAJ
Joined on Sun, Dec 13 2009, Posts 401
Disagree? Strongly??

I another threat you wrote ...

„Between that and the disappointing legato intervals in Synchron strings I am much more cautious and concerned about buying more of these products.“

So, when you write „disappointed, cautious and concerned“ ... what do you expect?
—Lurker-mode—
Posted on Tue, Jul 17 2018 18:17
by Dietz
Joined on Tue, Aug 06 2002, Vienna / Europe, Posts 7113

Originally Posted by: fahl5 Go to Quoted Post
If I remeber right, than numerical sounds already worked together with VSL for some Impuls responses of a VSL MIR precursor, what inspire some confidence. [...]

No, that wasn't the case. Ernest Cholakis of Numerical Sound created several highly impressive IR packages for the Convolution Reverb included in legacy Vienna Suite. But that was quite some time after the original Vienna MIR had been released, unrelated to this product.

/Dietz - Vienna Symphonic Library
Posted on Tue, Jul 17 2018 18:34
by fahl5
Joined on Fri, Feb 04 2005, Hall One, Posts 932

Originally Posted by: Dietz Go to Quoted Post

Originally Posted by: fahl5 Go to Quoted Post
If I remeber right, than numerical sounds already worked together with VSL for some Impuls responses of a VSL MIR precursor, what inspire some confidence. [...]

No, that wasn't the case. Ernest Cholakis of Numerical Sound created several highly impressive IR packages for the Convolution Reverb included in legacy Vienna Suite. But that was quite some time after the original Vienna MIR had been released, unrelated to this product.

I didn't meant to advertise anything, I just remebered that there was something in the VSL-Software (not related to MIR) which was anyhow related to numerical sound. If the only thing I know about a company that there was some kind of collaborative Contact to VSL that does not sound that bad to me. However I am sure it is worth to wait for real sordino samples, since tricks for an interim solution are already possible with the inbuild Filter and other Libraries often dont  get any further than that at all.

In short (numerical whatever): Tricks are already possible without any external help and a real sordino sampleset would be finaly the most satisfying solution.

http://klassik-resampled.de ... 3443 mp3 with 162 hours of sample based interpretations of complete Scores from 7 Centuries

http://synchron.12sf.de ...Synchron-Strings explored in 44 mp3 with more than four hours of complete and ambitious scores from 19th, 20th and 21th century produced with Synchron-Player Strings.

...anything comparable anywhere?
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