Concerns : installation of Synchronised Dimension Strings

I downdloaded the library with the latest Download manager, and installation started.

However, about halfway in, I had a frozen system due to another program.

After a restart, when Download manager came up again, the library was not shown anymore, so I opened the Libary Installer (also latest version)

When pointing the Library Installer to the package.info file, it gave me the error message "package.info is incomplete" ...

There was another thread (https://www.vsl.co.at/community/posts/t50630--SOLVED---This-package-info-file-is-incomplete) but, that incident happened with an older version of the Download Manager.

Any solution (apart from downloading everything again) ?

many thx

I'm getting a weird feeling about this VE Pro 7 product launch / pre-order ...

I participated in a VSL pre-order process before (Dimension Strings) , and despite it taking quite some time before the library was complete (sept 2012-august 2014 ...), at least you had a pretty good idea about what to expect.

The info we are getting now doesn't say anything about the expected functionality of the product, which is very disappointing, especially since VE Pro is not just another library, but rather an essential infrastructural part of our setups - something you want to plan ahead for.

It's a bit like a car salesman wanting you to sign up for a new car, while only able to tell you something about the great entertainement system that will be included for free. Nothing about the engine, the gearbox, the looks, the safety system - but "the kids will have a great time in the backseat" ...

So, please, give us some serious info asap ...

PS : adding a bonus almost as an afterthought, and only for 4 days - it only gets weirder 

OK - will work with the single-cell matrix (as a starting point anyhow).

thx

I can't seem to find a way to easily save just one Cell or any of theedited voice / patch contained within the Slots of that Cell.

I'm I missing something ? 

I know it's possible to save Presets, and Matrices, but a single Cell (and even a patch) are very usefull artifacts to be reused and hence preferably be stored independently of big Matrix structure ?

I'm already thinking about using a single-cell Matrix as the smallest alternative.

But of course, I do hope there is a more straightforward way to save/reuse them.

Many thx for feedback,

Joh

BTW : have checked all manuals I have, did I overlook something ?

Originally Posted by: Ionactive

...

I "will" work in VE Pro 6  - but cannot change presets - unless you wait for about 30 seconds...... 

Anyone see this? 

SOLVED... was going to delete this before posting, but just in case anyone finds the same. It will only work if the DAW is connected to the VE PRO 6 instance.....  if not it will not work, but with the connection made all is well :D.     Why does this matter ??

Phew! 

MArk

Don't know your setup but could be related to coupled/decoupled instance ...

Is there a way to avoid running ViennaInstrumentsMidi in every user account.

By itself would be quite harmless - except using a small bit of resources.

However, when there is a managed account on the computer - it continuously pops up asking for permission (to be granted by the admin of course) - making any normal computer work impossible.

Hopefully there's an easy answer to this ...

thx 

Did you check the crash report ?

Not exactly light literature, most of the time pretty obscure, but sometimes there's just enough readable stuff in there that can point you to the problem.

You mentioned "How can I remove the system" . If you have been using Time Machine, that's easy, just reinstall from the last Time Machine Backup. Same if you have used something like Superduper or Carbon Copy Cloner before you did the upgrade. 

I hope you did some kind of backup before the upgrade ?

good luck !

ipMidi is an app from http://www.nerds.de/

Does similar things as OSX's IAC, but is multi-platform (well actually, there's a Mac version and there's another Windows version).

Hans-Peter,

I'm currently looking into (ao) ipMIDI as part of the general "routing problem / solution(s)".

I am very curious about the "several reasons" you chose to use ipMIDI over the VEP built-in MIDI, can you elaborate a bit on that ?

thx !

Don't know about price, so I have to leave that out of the balance ...

4930k has 6 cores / 12 threads, 3770k has 4/8. 

However, this is only a very theoritical 50% increase in (parallel) computing power, since there are very few applications that use multi-processing / multi-threading well . (Not necessarily due to bad programming, depends also on the type of computing problem you have to solve. )

The benefits :

With two systems, you will definitely have more power, not only because of pure "raw computing cycles", but also more I/O throughput for memory, and especially for storage. 

(in some cases) Stability : certain plugins can have really big spikes in CPU cycle use, if you put them on a separate system, even if things would get rough on the second system, your DAW will continue to work as expected.

The drawbacks :

(very minor) Since you need memory for two active OS's , you will loose some memory, but if you have 16g on every pc, shouldn't be any problem , except for the most demanding situations. (just a question of filling them up with more chips ...)

Convenience : working one one system reduces complexity  :

- no need to setup sessions / frameworks, (un)link, (re)load

- easier to automate things (VEPro5 is a big improvement !!) - but that depends greatly on your needs

My opinion :

If you can live with the inconvenience of setting up the networked solution, the solution with two systems would have my preference.

Although i think Thunderbolt is a great interface, I don't see many reasons to have your decisions depend on it.

Would be different if we were talking about buying a portable (and even then).

The new Intel generation is mainly more power efficient, and doesn't bring real additional computing power.

To my opinion - if it's not for slave purposes - 16Gb is the baseline for a music PC, and the extensibility to 64Gb is definitely wellcome, certainly if you are using a lot of sample based instruments.

VIPro now allows you to use less memory by optimizing loading from SSD's, so that reduces the need for "real big memory space" to some extent. So yes, 32Gb will do the job, if you have a decent SSD.

If you're using may different instruments at the same time - it's better to split libraries over multiple discs, but of course that comes at a cost.

Really depends on how much "instruments in parallel" (with different samples) you need, and how often you need it ...

(if it's just now and then, you can always bounce some tracks)

In short :

- don't spend money on the new Intel chips, unless you find one with a better performance / price ratio (if you have enough $/€, don't forget to look at the Xeon based systems)

- start immediately with 8 Gb memory cards (at least 2), so you have room for expansion

- SSD system disc is nice, but not mandatory

- really fast SSD(s) for the samples

- seperate project/audio disk : type /(no) RAID depends on your specific needs

Good luck !

Maybe I am missing something here, and if I do so I apologize !

But as far I can understand from  the above, we're talking about instrument plugins, not fx plugins, right ?

1) The Product Info Page says :

"Vienna Ensemble PRO 5 is a cross-platform MIDI and audio LAN solution that works universally on Macs and PCs, hosting Vienna Instruments as well as third-party 64-bit and 32-bit VSTi/AU plug-ins. " 

Does not say that it will be only AU on Mac or only VST on PC, and the phrase "works universally on Macs and PCs" - mentioned separately from the claim that it is cross-platform - clearly suggests the software will "do the same" on both platforms. It also specifically claims support for third-party plugins, from either AU or VSTi type.

2) The Product Comparison Page  says :

3rd party plug-in hosting (VSTi/AU) 

•

•

Inserts for FX plug-ins (AU/Mac, VST/PC)

•

•

•

This info contradicts / nuances / reduces the claims made in the first page, in the sense that FX plug-ins (and only those !) will only be supported as a AU version on the Mac , a VST version on PC.

However, for third-party Instrument Plugins, no such distinction/limitation is mentioned at all. It actually reinforces the information in the previous page by clearly stating  "VSTi/AU", without any reference to a platform whatsover.

3) The Product Features Page  completely confirms the info in the  Product Info Page , and (even) does not mention the FX plug-in difference.

Conclusion :

From this information, there can only be some doubt about FX plug-in functionality. A prudent reader/potential customer would assume the worst case (platform dependent).

For Instrument Plugins , the case is clear however : Both VSTi and AU formats are (/or should be) supported on Mac and PC platform.

If that's not the case - haven't tried it myself, but certainly will in the near future - the product information provided is completely misleading.

That doesn't make VEPro a bad product - and it surely isn't - but if you're looking for this kind of functionality, you will be convinced the software does provide it, and there is no way to infer the opposite from the information provided ...

I assume most of us would prefer VSL to supply the promised functionality, meanwhile however, the least they should do is to provide complete, correct and unambiguous information to their (potential) customers. my 2c

If you just want 88 keys, without a real piano action : M-Audio Keystation 88es - basic, but very cheap, does the job

If you want piano action (and taking into account your budget) : better look for a secondhand - but not overly used - midi controller or stage piano. 

I personally use a Kurzweil PC-88, which has a nice piano action, 4 zones, allows several pedals to be connected, and has 4 continuous controllers + some switches onboard. Both pedals and controllers can be programmed individually for each zone. I really can recommend it ! (Would like to have a Kurzweil midiboard - for the polyphonic aftertouch)

Yamaha KX88 and the older Roland midi controllers are also nice.

The AKAI 88 key controller is getting some very good reviews as well, but don`t know if you`ll find one that fits the budget ...

good luck !

The sound-on-sound tech editor has a point, but there are other things to consider as well.

1) Maximum throughput of the interface between the processor and the "disc" : with multiple discs, potentially using different types of interfaces, the maximum throughput can be a lot higher then a single disc.

( there's currently no single SSD capable of using the full bandwith of thunderbolt / PCI or similar, let alone the full bandwith provided by the I/O chips on the motherboard)

2) SSD's that are re-written a lot, add internal copy/write overhead ( the so called write multiplication factor)

So basically, if you want to keep your library-discs as fast as possible, don't use them to write things on on a regular base ...

Also : don't put the VSL time stretch Cache on your library discs !

What is important is having a fast disc for (system) caches and stuff like that (R/W), for audio (R/W) , and for sample libraries (Read only).

I don't mind waiting a bit for an application or the OS to start, so if it would be just for that, I wouldn't need an SSD (that's a personal thing though, some people want a PC to start up as fast as possible).

However, for pragmatic reasons OS / applications / caches normally reside on the same disc, so if you can afford it, you'll still want this disc to be an SSD too.

Audio : If on the same disc as the OS/app/caches an SSD is must. If not : depends on number of tracks / sample rate. 

Sample Libraries : definitely SSD ! Don't put it on the same disc as the audio : the two BIG data streams (audio / samples) will go to the same disc , on top of that the "write multiplication factor" start playing a role if you write a lot of audio

Conclusion

If you can afford a fast external "disc" , do so.

Prefarably Thunderbolt (fastest AND more stable - less hickups - then USB 3.0) or SAS ($$), or USB 3.0 / dual eSATA.

You can choose to put audio or samples on the external disc, depends on your particular workflow / mobility demands.

- If you have really big / multiple sample libraries, it makes sense to take an enclosure that supports multiple SSD's in a RAID configuration.

(I assume we want to stick  with the "reasonably priced" stuff, muldi-disc multi(parallel)interface enclosure are out of scope)

- If you want to be able to do audio work on the road without an extra additional enclosure, it makes sense to put the audio disc internally

- If you want to "share" (physically de/reconnect) the project/audio disc with others / or with other systems , it makes sense to put the audio disc in the external enclosure.

Looking forward to hear about your future "acquisitions" !

PS : I don't know what kind of MBpro you have, but make sure the throughput in the optical bay slot is high enough ( I believe the current models have equal characteristics for main bay / optical bay).

I started to use VSL software & libraries just a couple of months ago. 

I now have the opportunity to purchase some additional libraries "secondhand".

When you buy these libraries now, you can have electronic delivery (download), however, the current owner purchased them on discs.

The licence itself can easily be transferred , but I wonder if - once I have the licence - I just can download the libraries ?

For convenience, speed & cost (transport + risk of being taxed twice) I would really like to do it this way.

Thinking about it, it's the only way I want to make this purchase - I don't really need the libraries now, but, if the conditions are right, it seems like a good opportunity, knowing that these libraries will also be at same quality level as the one I have now.

For my personal understanding, I don't really see a problem, but I just want to make sure !

Thx for a swift response

There are some things to consider, apart from the basics as "good feel" (personal !) , good velocity respons etc.

* aftertouch :

For me (!) aftertouch is a rather essential element of good control from a keyboard.

I still would love to find a 88 key POLY-aftertouch keyboard , which could provide a LOT of additional control !

Unfortunately, poly-aftertouch seems to be gone, apart from the VAX77. Kurzweil had the great MidiBoard, Roland the A80, but a 88 Key poly-aftertouch is history at this moment. I had some expectations for the Rhodes mk7 Midi (for the midi function that is), but now it seems our only hope is that Infinite Response makes a 88 key (weighted) controller someday ...

But even Mono (Channel-) aftertouch seems to be under "pressure" (sorry), since a lot of recent electronic pianos lack this function !!

So pay attention, or look for a real midi masterkeyboard 

* half-pedaling aka continuous sustain pedal :

Maybe not as essential for orchestral-only sounds, although I see some opportunies for control here as well, have not had the chance yet to experiment !

In this case, the electronic pianos - in general - have the benefit : recent "decent" models all support half-pedalling (besides the omnipresent sustain on/off function).

Some (!) midi synths / masterkeyboards have this function, but it's lacking in a surprisinly large group ...

Conclusion :

If you don't need 88 keys, put the Infinite Response VAX77 high on your list (great velocity respons, great aftertouch, half-pedaling, additional midi controls).

If you do : you're in for a more difficult search . Make priorities, then check your requirements thoroughly ! Maybe you can find some interesting stuff on the secondhand market ...

I'm new to the Vienna Instruments family, so bear with me if some of this is ... 

I'm currently planning my new studio setup. (well, the digital part, that is)

Why I consider using a multi-computer setup

As probably many of you, I use both "real instrument" emulations e.g. Vienna Dimension Strings, Synthogy Ivory etc, but also demanding virtual instruments e.g. Spectrasonics (which also rely on samples + a lot of DSP !) , FXpansion, U-He etc. , and effect plugins (Waves ao). 

Although there is a certain elegance, and certainly a lot of ease-of-setup in the "single big music computer" scenario, where DAW and all virtual instruments / effects reside in one system, I personally feel that there are some serious minusses as well :

• for a  really big system, the cost becomes very high - due to the fact that to get top performance, you will pay top money for the latest / fastest CPU's; motherboards that can handle 32+ GB memory, etc.  (there certainly is a law on diminishing returns if you take a look at high-end  CPU pricing !)
• what is considered "lots of memory" , "high speed" today, becomes - very fastly - barely enough (as I noticed : a single instance of U-He DIVA can take over an Intel i7 just like that …)
• all plugins in one environment increases the likelihood that they negatively "influence" each other  - there will always  be some form of resource contention
  • e.g. even if you have separate hard disks (SSD's) for system / audio / samples : once you have a number of sample playing plugins/instances accessing the same SSD, they will have a negative impact on each other
  • if a plugin has a certain "average" CPU use , but spikes from time to time (e.g. normal level + 50%), that might (should) not be a problem - however, if the spikes of multiple plugins coincide ... you have an issue (the kind of issue that comes unexpected, and often hard to predict)

Dividing the load on multiple system (a scenario made possible by the fantastic VSL VEPro software) seems to be a more strategic/stable choice :

• it allows you to dedicate systems to one or more plugins (avoiding "collateral damage"), 
• you can use mid-specced  computers - saving money. (unless you're Hans Zimmer, of course, then you'll just buy a server-farm )
• you can add capacity easily, just add a new (cheap) computer !
• on top of that, you can also combine multiple OS platforms, 
  • which provides highest flexibility : allowing you to use "any" DAW/plugin, 
  • and provide the best performing environment (some DAW's / plugins really run better on some platforms !).

The downside : setting up the whole thing (with added complexity if you use multiple OS's), adding plugins to a track in the DAW involves some additional steps using VEPro.

My Questions :

• In general : what's the experience of others in this ?
• What is a "minimal useful computing node" for a virtual instrument like Vienna Dimension Strings ?
  • What are the requirements (CPU, Memory, Disc speed) for a computer to run this kind of library as a whole
  • What are the requirements for a computer to run a section (e.g. just the violins) of this kind of library
• I have an opportunity to acquire some Apple XServe (2008) systems : does anyone have experience using these for a Vienna VI ? Anyone using it in this kind of setup ?
• is anyone using a VLAN to provide a closed & high-priority network for VEPro hosts ?
• is anyone using a SAN to provide (Sample) storage to multiple systems ?
• How about using a (decent) laptop as a front-end (mobility !) running just the DAW ? 

Thanks for reading - looking forward to your reactions !

Joh

Tried to download Instruments Pro (and afterwords Mir : same problem).

After adding it to the car, at check out time , I get the message : please add a product to your cart, and you're back to where you started.

So, basically, you can`t get the demo.

(I remember downloading a VEPro5 demo succesfully in the past, so maybe it's related to the products, or to the fact I now am a - logged-in - customer ???)

FYI : downloading files in the user area is no problem